how many

[shugotenshi]

Originally Posted by Warrior

Actually, we saw the ships in DIFFERENT formations, and saw nameplates for only two. So we truly do not know how many were there or what all their names were. So you can have six named ships as being there, even though only 5 were seen in any film shots.

I know there was a thread here that talked about that but I can't seem to find it.

Anyone know where it is? I'll keep looking.

[Centurion Draco]

Originally Posted by shugotenshi

Thanks for the links.



According to Serina's broadcast. The armistice negotiations were taking place on a ship called the Star Kobol.

The fact that we don't see this ship in formation with the fleet, or hear it mentioned in background combat reports, leaves me to believe that she was somewhere else in the system.

So it is possible that the columbia was at the peace conference acting as an escort to the Star Kobol.

There was a discussion about that very subject a few months back (here). I'm of the opinion that Serena is talking about not only a ship named 'Kobol' but in fact a battlestar and that she abreviates it in the same way that we'd chop Aircraft-Carrier to 'Carrier'.

[Sept17th]

I remember that conversation and still think she either dropped the "battlestar" in a line flub or as slang.

Originally Posted by Centurian Draco

...she definately says 'Star Kobol' makes me think 'BattleStar'. Like people say 'Carrier' instead of 'Aircraft-Carrier'.

Originally Posted by Sept17th

That has been my take.

http://www.colonialfleets.com/forums...6&page=1&pp=25

[peter noble]

Originally Posted by Sept17th

I remember that conversation and still think she either dropped the "battlestar" in a line flub or as slang.

The line in the actual script reads: So far, details of the armistice meetings going on at this very moment on the Star Kobol...

[Sept17th]

Well allright we now know Jane hit her line. I will believe it is short hand speak for battlestar.

[larocque6689]

The Experiment in Terra telemovie (which you may or may not consider "canon") said there were five Battlestars at Cimtar. Again, your mileage may vary.

[shugotenshi]

I think that the Star Kobol is a non-military vessel, cause of the way that Adar approached the peace summit.

I think he was trying to send a clear message to the cylons that he was serious about disarmament, which is the reason he had all the pilots of the fleet 'drink and make merry.' and the reason he wouldn't launch fighters in support of a fighter patrol that was under attack.

So with that in mind, I don't see him sending a military ship to the location of the peace summit. I think he'd choose a non-military vessel for the place of the signing of the peace treaty as a symbolic gester for ever lasting peace.

[Charybdis]

OK, I checked back in my Encyclopedia Galactica and under the heading "Battlestar" it says that there were 12 battlestars protecting the colonies at the time of the destruction...I copied this directly from the page in the book cause I'm having a hard time posting a pic...

(From top to bottom)
The Galacticas ready-room is bathed in red light so that pilots eyes will be ready for the darkaess of space.
Laser canon defend key areas on shutilecraft.
Prior to the Final Destruction, twelve battlestars defended the Colonies from Cylon attack.
B.ttlestars launch shuttlecraft to transport personnel and equipment to and from planetary surfaces.

So, I believe this may well have been the first reference to the 12 battlestars theory...

[shugotenshi]

Originally Posted by Charybdis

OK, I checked back in my Encyclopedia Galactica and under the heading "Battlestar" it says that there were 12 battlestars protecting the colonies at the time of the destruction...I copied this directly from the page in the book cause I'm having a hard time posting a pic...

(From top to bottom)
The Galacticas ready-room is bathed in red light so that pilots eyes will be ready for the darkaess of space.
Laser canon defend key areas on shutilecraft.
Prior to the Final Destruction, twelve battlestars defended the Colonies from Cylon attack.
B.ttlestars launch shuttlecraft to transport personnel and equipment to and from planetary surfaces.

So, I believe this may well have been the first reference to the 12 battlestars theory...

Someone has a very active imagination if they can say that there was one battlestar per colony from that. That line tells us that there was a 'fleet' of 12 battlestars protecting the colonies from a cylon attack. Not 12 battlestars constructed by each colony indivisually for the purpose of protecting the colony, that owned and operated the battlestar it built, first and for most.

So that theory doesn't hold much wieght unless someone can prove that battlestar A was built at caprica, and battlestar B was built at pisces, so on and so forth.

With the evidence so far, those battlestars could've been constructed at the fleet yards above Caprica.

Looking at the pilot it seemed to me that the colonial military reported directly to the council, not to a single colony, and that the crews were mixed. Which is consistant with how it is in the real world with our military reporting to the federal government, as oppose to the indivisual states, and made up of people from all 50 states.

[Centurion Draco]

Originally Posted by shugotenshi

I think that the Star Kobol is a non-military vessel, cause of the way that Adar approached the peace summit.

I think he was trying to send a clear message to the cylons that he was serious about disarmament, which is the reason he had all the pilots of the fleet 'drink and make merry.' and the reason he wouldn't launch fighters in support of a fighter patrol that was under attack.

So with that in mind, I don't see him sending a military ship to the location of the peace summit. I think he'd choose a non-military vessel for the place of the signing of the peace treaty as a symbolic gester for ever lasting peace.

Were that the case, President Adar wouldn't have had the entire remaining colonial fleet including at least five Battlestars there as well.


The truth of the matter is that 'Kobol' was probobly going to be the name of 'Atlantia' and that it was a late script change that for one reason or another was missed in Serena's speech.


There had been a 'lessening' of tensions between Cylon and the Colonies, leading up to the 'peace conference'.
There was a large battle at Molecay two yahrens prior to Saga in which one (Pegasus) or more Battlestars were lost.

I think it's safe to assume, seeing as Galactica is 500 Yahrens old, that in a 1000 yahren war, she was either VERY lucky, or part of a much larger fleet!
Is it logical to assume that the colonists would protect twelve planets with anything less than twelve Capitol ships and their Battle groups?

I assume that as Galactica seems linked to Caprica, every other colony would have wanted similar 'protection'. After all, if the five Battlestars were 'twinned' with specific planets, would you want to live on a non-twinned colony in the event of a simultanious attack on all twelve?

I think that the battle of Molecay and some other major engagements led to the depletion of both sides forces and capitol ships, which in turn caused a period of 'cease fire' in which the Cylons decided to change tactics, leading to the corruption of Baltar and the sneak attack that clearly caught the colonists by such fatal suprise.

[Charybdis]

I think that the "each coloney had a battlestar" is an offshoot of the 12 battlestar theory. If you have 12 battlestars, it is logical, sort of, to assume one for each colony, but I have never subscribed to the "each colony built it's own battlestar" theory either.

I think fandom just naturally placed each battlestar with one colony or something like that....

but the overall idea of there being 12 battlestars was very early on by this book...

[Gideon]

I was under the impression that "twelve battlestars" were left to guard the colonies, but they were just an extention of the fleet. I think in these terms... there was a huge fleet of many battlestars (of several types) patrolling the known colonial territories during the war (which is where the Pegasus came from I think). Some have been lost, but they always maintain at least the twelve for the colony worlds. Now, that does not stipulate where the rest are/were, nor does it say how many there were total when the fleet was at full strength. I have gathered this also from the fact that all of the beginning battlestars were named after their home-worlds, but those like Galactica and Pegasus replaced damaged or destroyed capitol ships with the non-named ships.

[shugotenshi]

Originally Posted by Centurian Draco

I assume that as Galactica seems linked to Caprica, every other colony would have wanted similar 'protection'. After all, if the five Battlestars were 'twinned' with specific planets, would you want to live on a non-twinned colony in the event of a simultanious attack on all twelve?

I haven't been able to discover a link between the Galactica and Caprica.

I have been able to link Commander Adama and his family to Caprica. That was established when he retreated from the battle to try to go home to find his wife, who was staying on caprica.

I think that the battlestars were mixed crew though because starbuck and boomer were from different colonies then Adama and his family. I wished they had went into more depth with the crew and their origins.

[Centurion Draco]

Originally Posted by shugotenshi

I haven't been able to discover a link between the Galactica and Caprica.

I have been able to link Commander Adama and his family to Caprica. That was established when he retreated from the battle to try to go home to find his wife, who was staying on caprica.

I think that the battlestars were mixed crew though because starbuck and boomer were from different colonies then Adama and his family. I wished they had went into more depth with the crew and their origins.

I'm not suggesting that the crews are exclusively born on any one colony, but I do think that the Batlestar's represent the 'Flagships' of each colony Fleet.

I think there is plenty to suggest a link between Caprica and Galactica.

When Adama starts to suspect that the lack of Base Ship's attacking the fleet indicates an imminent attack on the colony planets themselves he rushes straight to Caprica.

TIGH:
'Our long range scanners have picked up Cylon base ships here, here, and here. That puts them well within striking range of the planets Virgon, Sagitara, and.....'

ADAMA:
'I know, CAPRICA'

short scene with the Cylons beginning the attack.

ADAMA:
'Helm Bring us around, We're withdrawing. (then in a loud voice, as though to the entire bridge crew) FLIGHT SPEED FOR HOME'

Colonel Tigh is not a native Caprican, and neither are a lot of others on the Galactica. I suggest that Adama's use of the word 'home' refers to Galactica's 'home' and not him personally.

[Gemini1999]

Originally Posted by Centurian Draco

ADAMA:
'Helm Bring us around, We're withdrawing. (then in a loud voice, as though to the entire bridge crew) FLIGHT SPEED FOR HOME'

Draco -

Just a slight correction.... It's "Flank Speed"

(I just watched it 2 nights ago...)

Bryan

[shugotenshi]

Originally Posted by Centurian Draco

I'm not suggesting that the crews are exclusively born on any one colony, but I do think that the Batlestar's represent the 'Flagships' of each colony Fleet.

I think there is plenty to suggest a link between Caprica and Galactica.

When Adama starts to suspect that the lack of Base Ship's attacking the fleet indicates an imminent attack on the colony planets themselves he rushes straight to Caprica.

TIGH:
'Our long range scanners have picked up Cylon base ships here, here, and here. That puts them well within striking range of the planets Virgon, Sagitara, and.....'

ADAMA:
'I know, CAPRICA'

short scene with the Cylons beginning the attack.

ADAMA:
'Helm Bring us around, We're withdrawing. (then in a loud voice, as though to the entire bridge crew) FLIGHT SPEED FOR HOME'

Colonel Tigh is not a native Caprican, and neither are a lot of others on the Galactica. I suggest that Adama's use of the word 'home' refers to Galactica's 'home' and not him personally.

The last part make sense. I can see the link if home means the main base of the galactica is on caprica.

But I'm not to sure about the top part about each ship being the flagship of each colony fleet.

I still think that the colonials had a united fleet as opposed to each colony having thier own seperate militaries. And that that united fleet was controlled by the council instead of the governments of the indivisual colonies.

One of the things to support the united fleet theory is how Commander Cain treated Commander Adama. It was clear that Adama was the higher ranking officer, even though it appeared that cain might've came from the same colony as cassie.

[Centurion Draco]

Originally Posted by Gemini1999

Draco -

Just a slight correction.... It's "Flank Speed"

(I just watched it 2 nights ago...)

Bryan

Typical Gemon, stickler for detail
You're right of course!

[Centurion Draco]

Originally Posted by shugotenshi

The last part make sense. I can see the link if home means the main base of the galactica is on caprica.

But I'm not to sure about the top part about each ship being the flagship of each colony fleet.

I still think that the colonials had a united fleet as opposed to each colony having thier own seperate militaries. And that that united fleet was controlled by the council instead of the governments of the indivisual colonies.

One of the things to support the united fleet theory is how Commander Cain treated Commander Adama. It was clear that Adama was the higher ranking officer, even though it appeared that cain might've came from the same colony as cassie.

I agree, the fleet would be 'combined' if the need arose, like a major engagement against many base-stars etc. But in normal operations it would make sense for the fleet to be split into permanant subdivisions that act independantly of each other. Such as large navy's on earth do.
A second season could have answered sooo many questions

[Dawg]

Originally Posted by shugotenshi

The last part make sense. I can see the link if home means the main base of the galactica is on caprica.

But I'm not to sure about the top part about each ship being the flagship of each colony fleet.

I still think that the colonials had a united fleet as opposed to each colony having thier own seperate militaries. And that that united fleet was controlled by the council instead of the governments of the indivisual colonies.

One of the things to support the united fleet theory is how Commander Cain treated Commander Adama. It was clear that Adama was the higher ranking officer, even though it appeared that cain might've came from the same colony as cassie.

I agree - it was a united colonial fleet - but at the same time each planet will be responsible for building a portion of it - not unlike the shipyards of our own navy. Therefore, Galactica would be the Caprican flagship - Caprica being its home port, as it were. And commanded by a Caprican as well (although that might not be a mandated thing, in this case it was).

Tigh was Leonid, as was Boomer, yet both served positions of responsibility on Galactica.

I am
Dawg

[Pegasus4]

According to 2 episodes, Starbuck and Boomer were from Caprica. Starbuck was orphaned in the Umbra forest in one of the first Cylon attacks on Caprica according to his long lost father. Boomer told Athena trapped in the Rejuvination Center that he hotwired alot of hovermobiles as a kid on Caprica. Boomer from Leo is in one of Hatch's books. Maybe he was born on Leo and moved to Caprica as a kid?

I have the Encyclopedia Galactica. It has the years in the mid 6000s. I think it was a fan made book that somehow got published.

Glen Larson at the 15 Yahren reunion in 1993 was asked the names of the 12 battlestars and he replied that he never quite said there was that number, he said there were 12 planets.

The original novel btw also had (at least) 2 cruisers at the peace conference destroyed before the Atlantia.

I used to support the one battlestar per colony theory as a kid but doubt it now. maybe 12 fleets so that more than 1 Caprican, 1 Tauran, 1 Libran etc. can be a commander, colonel, etc. I would hope they promoted by skill and experience over birth hehe