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Old June 21st, 2003, 06:15 PM   #31
jjrakman
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LOL! Yeah U;ve seen that. Take it your not a big fab=n of the Ancient astonaut theory,eh Corwyn?
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Old June 21st, 2003, 07:29 PM   #32
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Not to knock anything which uses the theories for the basis of entertainment, but the AA theory is utter and complete nonsense.

That said, Zechariah Sitchin's theories would make a better movie than Von Danken's.
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Old June 21st, 2003, 07:32 PM   #33
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I'll certainly conced that the AA theories leave something to be desired scientifically, but why "utter and complete nonsense"? Just curious? Is it the theories themselves specifically, or just the whole general idea?
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Old June 21st, 2003, 07:48 PM   #34
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I just used that extreme to illustrate that though I don't believe in those theories, they still make good stories.

Really, it's several theories (to me):

1. Visitation in ancient times influenced our ancestors.
2. Aliens created man
3. Man came form space

1 is certainly possible. But we do know how the pyramids were built.
2 is worth thinking about, provided the theoretical circumstances work.
3 is just plain wacky.
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Old June 21st, 2003, 07:56 PM   #35
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I agree with you it is certainly wacky. I guess I'm more of a fence sitter.

I think AA's are possible because I think of human's possible future voyage to the stars. will we one day encounter a primitive yet intelligent species who might worship us as gods? I think that's possible. So why could it not have happened in our dim past? I've heard stories about when McArthur landed in some of the South Pacific islands that the primitives there made carvings of the aircraft and worshiped them as sky gods.

AS far as we know how the Pyramids were built. I'd say we don't necessarily know, but have a pretty darned goo idea. The only way to really know is to build a time machine and watch them being built.

But, while I think these "researchers" come up with some really good questions and strange findings that don't necessarily make sense in the orthodox scheme of things, there is yet to be one really good solid AA to be put forth.

Until then, yeah, they make great background stories don't they?
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Old June 21st, 2003, 11:31 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by jjrakman
LOL! Yeah U;ve seen that. Take it your not a big fab=n of the Ancient astonaut theory,eh Corwyn?
Correct. I don't buy it for a second.

However, it makes for fascinating SF speculation imo, and is suggested as a question in BSG, not stated as a fact, and thus adds hugely to the ambience, the feel, of BSG.

Such mysteries and hinted possibilities are something I miss deeply in much current "contemporary" SF today.
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Old June 22nd, 2003, 01:14 AM   #37
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Corwyn,

Can I ask why you don't buy it for a second? I'm honestly curious because as I said, I'm a fence sitter on this subject. I'd really like to know your reasons.

Regardless, I totally agree with you that it makes for great science fiction speculation. I don't think anyone can deny that.
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Old June 22nd, 2003, 04:15 AM   #38
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I am and have always been open on this. There are so many misterys and so much we don't know I won't rule out anything.
There is a mounting body of evidence around the world pointing to an advanced civilization some 12K years ago. Only human arrogance would dissmiss it and there are too many young, baby, and infant souls on the planet at this time as well.
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Old June 23rd, 2003, 12:27 AM   #39
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I am always amused by the attitudes of "orthodox scientists' on this topic. on the one hand, they will with utter confidence tell us they know how the Pyramids or Stonehenge or whatever was built, despite the paucity of evidence, certainly in written form, or they will tell us the history of this or that Pharaoh thanks to written records. BUT, if an ancient text tells us plainly that flaming boxes or whatever came down from the sky with weird creatures in them, then, of course, the ancients were full of it. Selective blindness!
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Old June 23rd, 2003, 06:02 AM   #40
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Default Re: The Ancient Astronaut aspects of BSG

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Originally posted by
I thought it might be fun to discuss some of these themes and how it relates to BSG. Ther are a few Sci Fi shows that have dealt with the subject. To my mind I can think of obviously BSG, but also, Stargate, The Pheonix, and Otherworld.

There are also several books that have been written by researchers into this field regading the idea that humanity's dim dim past started with visitors from the stars, or a prior high tech civilization that was wiped out by a catastrophe thus forcing mankind to re-invent the wheel. It is believed that this is where many of the legends concering Atlantis and Lemuria arose. Some of the authors who have dealt with this subject would include, Richard C. Hoagland, Graham Hancock, Zecharia Sitchin, Robert Schoch, Erich Von Daniken, and John Anthony West.

There have even been recent geologial findings that suggest the Sphinx of the Giza plateau is at least 10,000 years old, 4000 years older that the known beginnings of human civilzation according to orthodox science.

So what say you, were the Egyptian monuments and other megolithic structures around the world created by workers or slaves, or by someone else...

.
Don't forget Robert E. Howard's Conan and Kull, and H. P. Lovecraft's Cthulhu mythos.

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Old June 23rd, 2003, 06:13 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by jjrakman
Corwyn,

Can I ask why you don't buy it for a second? I'm honestly curious because as I said, I'm a fence sitter on this subject. I'd really like to know your reasons.
Of course you can.

I haven't seen any evidence.

Every unusual or mysterious thing that has been found which hasn't been fraudulent has at best proven only that it is unusual or mysterious so far, nothing more.
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Old September 9th, 2003, 11:29 AM   #42
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I'd figure I'd bump this one too, great discussions here as well.
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Old September 9th, 2003, 05:17 PM   #43
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The ancient astronaut, Egyptian-Mayan Atlantis-Kobolian connections have been what it's about for me in regards to BG
I have a link here that ties in ancient mysteries and the Bible. I don't subscribe to them as being "Gospel" but they make for interesting listening.

http://www.drgenescott.com/thearchives.htm

Click the left menu on subject and then click mysteries
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Old September 9th, 2003, 05:37 PM   #44
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Quote:
.The ancient astronaut, Egyptian-Mayan Atlantis-Kobolian connections have been what it's about for me in regards to BG
For me that was always at the very heart of BSG as well.
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Old October 12th, 2003, 01:05 AM   #45
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*BUMP*
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Old October 12th, 2003, 05:06 AM   #46
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Winemaster,

Cool site!!!

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Old October 22nd, 2003, 04:29 PM   #47
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Maybe Glen Larson received a vision and was inspired to write BSG? There are those who believe that life here, began out there...

Seriously though, it is very possible that ancient civilizations were more advanced than we give them credit for. We have verifiable examples of civilizations going through dark ages where a lot of knowledge was lost. Just look back to the fall of the Roman Empire. It took many years for Europe to regain the sophistication it had before the empire fell. It is entirely possible that an advanced civilization existed and disappeared before the recorded data that we currently have.
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Old December 6th, 2003, 07:23 PM   #48
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I thought it might be time to bump this thread up again for the new folks!
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Old December 7th, 2003, 06:51 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by jjrakman
I I've heard stories about when McArthur landed in some of the South Pacific islands that the primitives there made carvings of the aircraft and worshiped them as sky gods.
ACtually no, it's a bit different to that. (excuse me butting in here...)

THe islanders saw the planes and the cargo they brought with them and assumed, since they were the blessed of the gods, that the planes were supposed to be bring them gifts from the gods. They also reasoned that the white man had captured these flying spirits and enslaved them, so they built their own runways and towers in the mountains, away from the white men, to try and entice the flying spirits back to freedom, so they could then partake of the cargo of gifts from their gods.

You see they werne't stupid. They knew that theplanes weren't gods, but without an understanding of what happened inside the planes, they assumed that they were sent by their gods. To them, the flight of these great metal beasts was a magical event. Just goes to show that Clarke was right. Any technology sufficiently advanced is indistinguisable from magic. People always assumed he was talking about aliens in the past...
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Old December 7th, 2003, 09:39 PM   #50
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Hey thanks for clarifying that. That was really interesting, and it still kind of proves the point I was trying to make, which was Clarke's statement.
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Old December 10th, 2003, 07:23 PM   #51
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Default Dr Eugene Scott

Well,thanks for the link winemaster.
I remember his show back in the old days,very high entertainment value.He would play the same video repeatedly until he got enough donations.Sometimes taking up the whole show.Thought he was long gone.
But I certainly don't want to offend a fellow student of fermentation science about religion.

JJ-are you still on the fence about Cydonia?
I am an avid disbeliever about this,but my brewing buddy swallows it hook line and sinker.

Much of this falls into the kooky category,but I am at home with that kind,as is anyone who has ever been to an LP official function.

I live in the same town as Bart Siebrel (moonmovie.com) and first heard of him by meeting him at a party.His dog is way smarter than he is.

Check out badastronomy.com for much debunking info,though they don't have much on the Cydonia as presented by enterprisemission.com though I have seen some embarassing "guilt by association" evidence aginst their claims by searching the yahoo groups.

NASA put out several photos of the "face" region from different angles. Maybe we shouldn't trust the govt. but Mars is too close to lie about for long.

Glad I found this thread,as I was going to start one asking where you all came down on the Von Daniken theories.Seems I recall an old Nova ep on PBS that destroyed the Chariots of the Gods book.

Anyone out there read The King in Yellow by Chambers?
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Old December 10th, 2003, 07:25 PM   #52
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Those are fantastic links thanks for posting them!
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Old January 7th, 2004, 09:41 PM   #53
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Well, here comes my periodic bumping of this thread.
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Old January 8th, 2004, 05:09 PM   #54
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Thanks for clarifying that Proximo! I like your insight.
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Old October 1st, 2005, 10:58 AM   #55
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This was a good conversation too.
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Old October 1st, 2005, 01:23 PM   #56
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Part of Galactica's appeal for me is the core message of "There are those who believe life here, started out there" and the show's leanings into Egyptology and classical mythology is what makes it so unique.

Lost Planet of the Gods part two is the episode that really the showcase for this mission statement and it's pulled off with some great writing and production value.

I still think Graham Hancock and Von Daniken are cranks though.
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Old October 1st, 2005, 02:25 PM   #57
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For myself that's what always struck a cord in me with this show. The idea that our civilization began somewhere in the stars long ago. And that we've forgotten our dim pre-history.

von-Daniken, yeah he's probably more crank than he is historian or scientist.

Hancock, I think has been misrepresented and misunderstood publically. What Hancock presents isn't necessarily a theory so much as it is a question. Questioning certain things that simply do not seem to make sense in orthodox Egyptology, or general history for that matter.

If you put aside the "crank" view, and the orthodox view and simply look at a few basic facts, it should at least give someone pause enough to raise an eyebrow.

One such fact would be the redating of the Sphinx by Robert Schoch. As having to have been built 7-8 thousand years ago, before human civilization supposedly began. You can't really deny geological facts.

The other is the Great Pyramid. When you strip away all of the theories as to it's construction, and simply look at the logistics of it, it becomes mindboggling. The weight and precision of the thing. The number and sizes of the stones. The supposed allotment of time given to complete it's construction. These are things that can not be duplicated today.

Then you have the fact that there are pyramidal constructions all over the planet. We have one here in Wisconsin built by an off shoot of the Chahokia Indians. There's something like 400 cultures world wide that each havbe their own cataclysm myth, and the legends of the time prior when there was a Golden Age of technology. Yet how could these people arrive at the same concepts, without ever coming into contact with one another? Unless there was a common ancestral civilization from which they sprang.

There seems to be two prevelant mindsets as to human progress.

1) That the current state of technology and knowledge is the very height that can ever hope to be achieved.

2) That human progress always moves slowly forward.

We know that what came after the Roman Empire fell, wasn't exactly a leap forward. Yet we still cling to this always moving forward concept.

Von Daniken, meh.

Hancock though, does present some interesting questions.
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Old October 5th, 2005, 08:47 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldwardaggit
(Cue Stu Phillips music. The same music that was at the start of the original)
(Camera shot coming down threw the sky until we see the back of a boy and his grandfather standing in front of the great pyramid so that we don’t get to see their faces)

(Boy) Grandpa Where did people come from?

The Grandfather thinks for a minute and decides to give his Grandson a broad answer because he wants his Grandchild to make his own decisions with out the interference of his own beliefs.

(Grandfather) Well, there are many different views on this subject.
Some believe that God made man in his own image right here on earth.
Others believe that we are the end result of evolution.

And there are those who believe that life here began out there. Far across the universe with tribes of humans who may have been the four fathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltec’s, or the Mians. That they may have been the architects of the great pyramids or the lost civilization of the Miriam or Atlantis. Some believe that there may yet be brothers of man who even now fight to survive far , far away amongst the stars.

(The voice sounds familiar and as the camera circles the Grandfather, We see the devilish smile of Patrick Mcnee. Then the screen goes black and we here him laugh with a bit of an echo on his voice.)

(Then we have Stu Phillips starting music for the credits as the black screen fades in with stars to let us know that we are traveling to that far away place.)

(Credits end with a fade in to a shot of a huge hall and it soon becomes apparent that we are at a grand funeral for some one. Looking at the front of the room, we see Tigh decked out in full uniform. We see a bit of a tear in his eye as he begins to speak.)

(Tigh) Adama My friend, my dear, dear friend. You were there for me through out my life and now for one last time, I’m here for you.

(As Tigh continues, we see the back of someone with dark hair; leave the room in a bit of a hurry. When the funeral is over, we see some people in the corridor talking down about what will happen to the fleet now that Adama has passed and they are also talking down about how Apollo didn’t even have the stomach to stay for the whole funeral .How no one can find him on the Galactica. Then they look up to see some smoke roll from around the corner. At first we see the end of the fumarello, then the smile of Dirk Benedict.)

(Shuttle Pilot) Captain Starbuck, we didn’t see you there.
(Starbuck) Looks like you boys just stepped in to some deep felgercarb.
and Ah.... yes, don’t worry about Apollo. I know exactly where he is.

(Camera shot zooming in to the Galactica and as we get closer, we zoom in on the celestial tube on top of the Galactica. We then see someone sitting in there and as the camera zooms in on Richard Hatch sitting in a bit of a dark shadow, we here him say.


(Apollo) Father, why is it that I should feel the closest to your spirit, here?

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WELL WRITTEN! That was better than some of the TOS shows! Would make a great start for a new BSG series based on the original - not the TRIPE the Sci-Fi channel has going now.
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Old October 5th, 2005, 09:22 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peter noble
Graham Hancock is regarded as a crank in my country.

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Old October 6th, 2005, 07:46 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bug-Eyed Earl
I just used that extreme to illustrate that though I don't believe in those theories, they still make good stories.

Really, it's several theories (to me):

1. Visitation in ancient times influenced our ancestors.
2. Aliens created man
3. Man came form space

1 is certainly possible. But we do know how the pyramids were built.
2 is worth thinking about, provided the theoretical circumstances work.
3 is just plain wacky.
BEE,

Sorry, but I have to call you on #1 & #3.

Let me say, flat out, that I have no idea how the Great Pyramid was built -- but I can certainly tell you how it wasn't built; nobody drags c.60-ton granite slabs up an uncompacted incline, making 90° turns, to slide it into place at a reverse 45° angle...

While that's certainly not the only argument(they're really too numerous to list here), I'll give you one more:

It is estimated that there are approximately 2.5 million individual blocks of stone within the Great Pyramid; it is also estimated that it took about 30 years to build; being as I'm a very nice guy, I'll give the Egyptians an extra 10 years.

2.5 million blocks divided by 40 years equals 62,500 blocks placed, per year...or, 171.23 blocks per day or 7.13 blocks per hour, assuming a 24 hour work period. Note that this allows for no off-days for religious festivals, accidents, bad weather, etc....

Which is why your garden-variety Egyptologists react with such venom when people ask simple questions that their theories ignore.

As regards #3, if you have a truly catastrophic event occur on Earth, there may be no other refuge except space...any survivors would necessarily "come from space"....
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