We'll Survive!

[Shatter]

Originally posted by cdlegend
I believe that it will hastily join Galactica 1980 as one of those bad nights when Starbuck has had too much ambrosia and wakes up in a cold sweat wondering how he made it back to the Galactica.

This quip from cdlegend in the “If a new series comes out of this Mini” thread got me thinking about the history of the franchise, and led me to a pretty positive realization.

One short year after the departure of TOS came Galactica 1980, a series that most fans of TOS don’t even acknowledge the existence of (except for, on some occasions, the lone episode that featured Starbuck). Galactica 1980 was an attempt by the network to cash in on the popularity of TOS (which executives had not recognized until after the show was cancelled) at a bargain basement price. The series featured shaky writing, cut-rate special effects, and it abandoned most of the characters from the original production. Most fans don’t recognize Galactica 1980 as part of the Galactica canon. The general sentiment seems to be that Galactica 1980, on the whole, is best forgotten.

Frankly, I see a lot of parallels between the upcoming mini-series and Galactica 1980, both in terms of the way the mini-series ignores, or attempts to completely alter, key elements of TOS, and the way that most strong fans of TOS regard the new mini. But the positive point I draw from this comparison is this: although Galacitca 1980 was horrible, it didn’t succeed in quashing enthusiasm or support for TOS. TOS has retained its supporters for twenty-five years, and its legacy remains undamaged by the Galactica 1980 misfire.

In the same way, I believe that the mini-series will come and go. Sure, it will stir up some reaction during its brief tenure, but ultimately I think it will fade away. It won’t dampen the support of fans for TOS, nor will it succeed in overshadowing the original production. It will eventually just be a footnote, like Galactica 1980 is today. And eventually, the same fans that have been staunch in their support of TOS, will get a production (most likely a film from the way things are shaping up) that is true to the tradition and character of the original.

All that to say: don’t give up!

[amberstar]

Thank you for echoing my own thoughts on this. I also believe that come what may, this mini will not tarnish the TOS. We the fans will keep TOS alive another 25 yahrens if need be.
This mini will come and go just like G80, but TOS classic elements and storyline will live on forever.

Keeping The Faith,
Amberstar

[Charybdis]

on what Amberstar has written, I am beginning to think that maybe, just maybe, we might should leave the TOS alone and drop this continuation thing....

Our love for BSG stems from the original airing of the show when most of us where in childhood. What a fantastic memory!!!

BUT, now it is different. Now we totally understand what we are watching. Now is a different age in which we live.

Do any of you have any inkling of just leaving the original series alone and forgetting all this revival stuff??/

I am worried that even though we get a continuation, so much will have changed that no matter how good it is, we can never go back to that magical time of 1978 again. We will view it with adult eyes now.

Any thoughts would be appreciated...

[BST]

Originally posted by Charybdis

I am worried that even though we get a continuation, so much will have changed that no matter how good it is, we can never go back to that magical time of 1978 again. We will view it with adult eyes now.

Respectfully disagree.

I don't want to go back to 1978 again except to use the Original stories as a "launch point", so to speak, for a continuation. There is so much of the Original story that is, as of yet, untold. Personally, I would like to see an expansion of the Colonial mythos, flashbacks to a time period when Iblis was one of the "good guys" and the events that caused him to be expelled from "heaven". In addition, I would like to see how kind, or unkind, time has been to those characters that have become endeared to us and to see the rest of their story told. It would also be necessary to acknowledge the 25 year time span and to incorporate new warriors/characters into the mix. And, I would love to see them eventually find Earth but, at a time in our history when we will be somewhat on par with them, in order to provide a more credible defense against the Cylons.

My primary motivation, when discussing the show, comes from a business perspective and that is "to add value" to the product. That is one of my many criticisms of the script that has been penned by Ron Moore. His handling of the product has done absolutely NOTHING to ADD VALUE to the franchise. In fact, what he has done, in starting over, is to lessen the overall value of the show. At the end of the 4th hour of the mini, the show will not even be as far along as it was by the end of the Original Series. IMO, a horrible waste of programming dollars just to "do it my way".

To a "thoughtful" writer, the unrealized potential of the Galactica story (and Pegasus, too) is a gold mine. There IS much to reap from the seed that was sowed 25 years ago, ..... with the proper cultivation.

Can it be done? I believe that it can, by someone truly aware of the value of what is in front of them.


One last item, and please don't misinterpret this as a slam. I've read statements similar to this many, many times and am still bewildered about it.

Now we totally understand what we are watching. Now is a different age in which we live.

How so? How have audiences become so sophisticated through the course of these many years? They watch the same types of shows that we did -- sitcoms, dramas, game shows, soaps. Sprinkle in a "reality" show or a Bachelor/Bachelorette show and you've pretty much covered the market.

At what point in time did the audience suddenly "grow up"?

BST

[Charybdis]

I think my statement reflects the style of filmmaking and television that is presented nowadays as opposed to shows that were on in the late 1970s.

For example, the original series descended into sometimes camp and kind of lame actions and situations (Hector and Vector anyone?). That was OK and perfectly viable back in 1978, but I would argue that in a serious science fiction work of 'today' that might not fly anymore. You see, the style of storytelling has changed from the way movies and tv shows are made. I'm not sure if I'm describing it well, I hope you get my meaning...

[BST]

Charybdis,

I understand what you're saying and to some extent, I agree. (Let's face it, no matter how serious the show, some humor has to be injected from time to time). I don't long for a return to the Hector/Vector show, either but, what I am interested in seeing is the underlying theme of the show expanded upon -- the never-ending battle between good and evil. In actuality, there are only the 2 options. That's why I completely disagree with Moore's smearing of the lines. IMO, there is NO gray area.

That is also why I'm so interested in the story begun in War of the Gods. I really feel that what was presented, on TV, was a 'proxy war' between the 2 superpowers - Beings of Light and Iblis. The Colonials and Cylons were just the latest pawns in that war. It's that storyline that I would love to see played out, to its eventual conclusion.

With regards to overall storytelling, I don't know if I consider today's to be more sophisticated, just less censored. In reality, has the actual content of the stories, of today, changed or is it that we SEE more or HEAR more?

I think it's more of the latter rather than the former.

BST

[Muffit]

Good words Shatter. You may well be right!

[Dawg]

I've got to agree with a lot of what BST has said. It's not the stories that have changed, it's the method of storytelling.

Because of the world we live in, arti imitating life and, to an extent, vice-versa, the storytelling techniques of today are far different than they were 25 years ago. In addition, the technology of storytelling has changed, become more detailed.

You could not sell Saga of a Star World, as it was made 25 years ago, now. It's lame. It's too goody-two-shoes. If you were going to make the same story today, there would be more conflict, more attention paid to the people left behind, more anguish. Apollo would find fault with his father that he didn't in 1978. There would be partial nudity; you could count on seeing both Athena and Cassiopeia in the sack with Starbuck (probably not at the same time, mind you).

But that would not change the underlying themes, the basic story. The survivors would rise to the occasion, pulling together to survive. The heroism would still be there, the evil of the purely alien, robotic Cylons, the devil that is Iblis vs. the Ships of Light.

Audiences are more sophisticated now, because they expect to see more, expect less sugar-coating on thier programming. Accomodating that sophistication does not mean gutting the basic premises and story line. I don't care if you're talking continuation or remake.

My thoughts. Take them for what they're worth.

I am
Dawg

[Charybdis]

Dawg put down what I was trying to say pretty well. You could not sell Galactica the way it was back then today. AND, if you add in those elements that audiences expect today (the sex, violence, etc.) you have what MooreRon is selling. Is THAT the Galactica we want? I say NO!

ANd if you sort of keep it the way it was, would it sell today? It is a conundrum..

[Dawg]

AND, if you add in those elements that audiences expect today (the sex, violence, etc.) you have what MooreRon is selling.

I think you missed my point, Charybdis.

What I am saying is that while today's audiences demand a "realer" portrayal (in that, Moore is right), that need can be accomodated without gutting the story the way the mini does, and without alienating part of the audience.

Sex, for example: if Saga were being made now, we would probably see Starbuck and Cassiopeia in bed. This is one of the aspects of their relationship that is barely hinted at in the original, but if you think about it, this would be a strong part of their relationship. Today's audiences expect a more thorough examination of relationships than they would have thought of doing in 1978, so them in bed (or in a launch tube) is reasonable. It can also be handled in such a way to keep it "family-friendly" but still get the point across better than Standards and Practices allowed them to get away with 25 years ago.

It isn't just the hair we can't go back to, my friend, but we can present the same, basic story using today's sensibilities. I wish that's what Moore had done rather than plaster the BSG nameplate on this non-BSG project.

I'm late for work now.

I am
Dawg

[Charybdis]

Aha! That's it!!! Family friendly...Can BSG still be made to be family friendly today without going over the top with sex and violence?? I wouldn't really want to see Starbuck and Cassie in bed to tell you the truth. The launch tube sequence was OK by me (they did film a version with a shirtless Starbuck but cut it).

My beef is the fact that due to society's low standards, why does every filmmaker need to put in gratuitous sex and violence? I am getting tired of it. As a father of two young daughters, I can't even watch anything on network TV anymore. Not even the sitcoms!

I do think that a proper continuation could be made, Richard's trailer sort of proved that the concept of reality could be inserted into a new BSG. I'm just getting tired of the fight and I was just musing that maybe it just needs to be left alone and not messed with anymore...

[Dawg]

It's my understanding that ABC made them re-shoot it with his shirt on. I could be wrong about that, but I seem to recall the story being told.

My point is that there was good, hard, valuable material glossed over for 1978 sensibilities that would be a gold mine today. And, nothing would have to be taken away from the original in order to explore those aspects today.

Yes, even sex can be presented in a family-friendly way. Personally, I'd like to see more of it; healthy relationships portrayed in a healthy manner can only leave good impressions. If it's played up for the thrill (Enterprise's premier, for example, didn't need to show so much of Jolene Blalock to make the scene work- it was the shock and titilation value - pun intended), then it gives the wrong impression.

No, it's not time to give up the ship, Charybdis. Take a break, maybe, get some rest, but to give up is to say there's nothing left of BSG worth acknowledging; it's saying the story is dead.

Well, it's not, not as long as there are people who love the story, are willing to talk about it, to support the efforts of moviemakers to recreate and revive it, to write their own stories based on it, to read the books published about it, etc. etc. etc. There's a thread here at CF about the possibility of creating a whole line of BSG books, ala the Star Trek book franchise. No, BSG is not ready to be given up on, my friend. We may not have the influence of a Star Trek fanbase, we may have only a handful of friends who know people in Hollywood, but we are a passionate bunch who aren't willing to let go. Stick with us.

I am
Dawg

[Charybdis]

Oh, I'm not around here after 25 years for nothing!!! In fact, I had contacted a publisher about a book idea. If anyone knows about publishing and getting started with a great idea, Warrior, for example. I would love to get in touch and let you know what's going on and maybe we could get something else done with getting more BSG books out there...

[Dawg]

Gee - my last post in this thread was a magic number, and I didn't even realize. Rock on!

Anyway, Charybdis, go here:

http://www.colonialfleets.com/forums...&threadid=4255

This is a discussion about creating a line of BSG books.

I am
Dawg

[Shatter]

Originally posted by Dawg
...but to give up is to say there's nothing left of BSG worth acknowledging; it's saying the story is dead.

Well, it's not, not as long as there are people who love the story, are willing to talk about it, to support the efforts of moviemakers to recreate and revive it, to write their own stories based on it, to read the books published about it, etc. etc. etc.

I couldn't agree more with the sentiments you express in these statements Dawg. BSG may have a hit a rough spot with the new mini, but it is very much alive. And as long as there are faithful fans who cherish it, it will continue to be alive and well.

[BST]

Good Words, Dawg and Shatter!

The Original BSG will NEVER DIE as long as we keep the faith and keep trying!