Sex sells, but does romance make a better story?

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by Gaelen

ouch antelope poor old Starbuck thanks fo the laugh though. it's true its the tease that works best on tv.

Shinigstar you warm my heart with your story. But i'm saying I'm not the kind of girl who can wait, I don't want to wait, I like that part and need that part of life too much to give it up.

Enjoy then

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by Dawg

I see your family is not entirely bereft of taste....



*Did I say that out loud?*

:confused: :uhdrop:

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

I am
Dawg

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by antelope526

You make me laugh! I don't know whether I should laugh or cry.

He was teasing Antelope

[unowhoandwhy]

Originally Posted by shiningstar

Love the Avatar is that a German short hair pointer?

Yes, it is a GSP. That's my Daniel Yankee Flyer (Daniel, Danny, Little Ba$!@rd depending on what he's doing at the moment), one and a half years old and the best dog ever. (My former couch, former cell phone, former slippers, former pillows. etc. probably wouldn't agree on that, though!)


And who knew that I would miss a good debate on marriage while I was offline for the weekend? Between my two parents I had to live through seven marriages and five divorces before I was 25, so I am extremely cautious about the whole institution. I would like to get married and have kids someday (I am only 31), but I won't get married just because that is what people expect of me. I'd like to marry completely for love and if I have to wait (and I've been waiting a while now) I would like to spend that time with men who I like and respect and am physically attracted to. Which hasn't happened in about four years, but I am looking for "Mr. Right" and not "Mr. Right Now" so that's OK. A little lonely, but OK.

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by unowhoandwhy

Yes, it is a GSP. That's my Daniel Yankee Flyer (Daniel, Danny, Little Ba$!@rd depending on what he's doing at the moment), one and a half years old and the best dog ever. (My former couch, former cell phone, former slippers, former pillows. etc. probably wouldn't agree on that, though!)


And who knew that I would miss a good debate on marriage while I was offline for the weekend? Between my two parents I had to live through seven marriages and five divorces before I was 25, so I am extremely cautious about the whole institution. I would like to get married and have kids someday (I am only 31), but I won't get married just because that is what people expect of me. I'd like to marry completely for love and if I have to wait (and I've been waiting a while now) I would like to spend that time with men who I like and respect and am physically attracted to. Which hasn't happened in about four years, but I am looking for "Mr. Right" and not "Mr. Right Now" so that's OK. A little lonely, but OK.

It's a beautiful dog.

I think you're doing the right thing in waiting for Mr. RIght and not rushing
out for Mr. RIghtnow. Somethings are worth waiting for. I know I'm glad I
did.

Originally Posted by Gaelen

[size=2]]Ah my favourite subject… I very much agree with Dawg, the scene can’t just be plunked down for the sake of throwing in a sex scene then it just bores me. I do like the occasional very romantic and sweet scene but only in a movie it would bore me if it was a week to week occurrence. In a week to week programme I love tension filled, but I don’t want the will they won’t they stuff either. I never want the pair to be married or engaged, makes it too safe for me (I know in reality it’s different).

Let me preface this by saying it's ONLY my opinion, and not intended to offend anyone...

Hmmm.. interesting question. Frankly, I need the romance more than the sex. Example in point - that first clinch between Boomer and Tyrol - honestly, it was useless. They took out the explanation of it being fraternization and its involvement with the plot from that end, so it just seemed... well, useless.

Now... when Boomer comes back - and you've had those few subtle lines like when Kara asks about Sharon - suddenly this reunion isn't about sex. The second clinch is actually much less intense then the first: clothes stay on, folks are watching, pretty innocent kisses compared to earlier. But as far as.... importance. There's no contest. Here you have a relationship - not just sex. That makes it different. I could watch that scene over and over (and have) because of that chemistry... well, that and Tyrol's sweet smile before that last kiss...

Then we have Lee and Kara - nothing sexual there. Well, nothing mentioned (he does have trouble keeping his eyes at eye-level, but maybe that's my interpretation). Anyway, the scenes between the two of them fascinate me, and they barely touch, much less kiss. Hell, half the time they're ready to brawl <g>. The characters hae chemistry though - they work well together. Even if there's never anything romantic there, the relationship of the characters has my interest.

I loved many of the shows y'all have mentioned, and many others, that relied on sexual tension based on friendship (or antagonism, they're pretty close sometimes) - Moonlighting and Beauty and the Beast... but also Scarecrow and Mrs. King, Lois and Clark and many many others. What I like had nothing to do with the sex... mostly nothing to do with the romance... it was the RELATIONSHIP that fascinated me. Still does.

I've written loads of fanfic - in many different fandoms - and while some of it is more "explicit" than the rest, all of it is relationship based. If that's romantic, then fine. But sex for the sake of sex.... sorry, that's just porn, and I can do without. I found no meaning at all in the Baltar/Six scenes. I fast forward them every time <g>. There's no point. Just... no point. At least not for me.

-Crys-

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by CrysWimmer

Let me preface this by saying it's ONLY my opinion, and not intended to offend anyone...

Hmmm.. interesting question. Frankly, I need the romance more than the sex. Example in point - that first clinch between Boomer and Tyrol - honestly, it was useless. They took out the explanation of it being fraternization and its involvement with the plot from that end, so it just seemed... well, useless.

Now... when Boomer comes back - and you've had those few subtle lines like when Kara asks about Sharon - suddenly this reunion isn't about sex. The second clinch is actually much less intense then the first: clothes stay on, folks are watching, pretty innocent kisses compared to earlier. But as far as.... importance. There's no contest. Here you have a relationship - not just sex. That makes it different. I could watch that scene over and over (and have) because of that chemistry... well, that and Tyrol's sweet smile before that last kiss...

Then we have Lee and Kara - nothing sexual there. Well, nothing mentioned (he does have trouble keeping his eyes at eye-level, but maybe that's my interpretation). Anyway, the scenes between the two of them fascinate me, and they barely touch, much less kiss. Hell, half the time they're ready to brawl <g>. The characters hae chemistry though - they work well together. Even if there's never anything romantic there, the relationship of the characters has my interest.

I loved many of the shows y'all have mentioned, and many others, that relied on sexual tension based on friendship (or antagonism, they're pretty close sometimes) - Moonlighting and Beauty and the Beast... but also Scarecrow and Mrs. King, Lois and Clark and many many others. What I like had nothing to do with the sex... mostly nothing to do with the romance... it was the RELATIONSHIP that fascinated me. Still does.

I've written loads of fanfic - in many different fandoms - and while some of it is more "explicit" than the rest, all of it is relationship based. If that's romantic, then fine. But sex for the sake of sex.... sorry, that's just porn, and I can do without. I found no meaning at all in the Baltar/Six scenes. I fast forward them every time <g>. There's no point. Just... no point. At least not for me.

-Crys-

Nice points and I've read your fanfic. Not bad at all.

[N~still]

Actually my past relationships are painful and i don't like to speak of them in an open forum..... I did learn through trial and error exactly what you guys have said. I was incredibly adaptable to my partners; i could always relate and empathize with parts of them but we never jived the the whole outlook and future thing and that is vital. Love and the intimacy of sex will take you into wonderland but one day the ruby slippers will slip off and you wil be back in Kansas again. it's best to be with someone you want to be with when that happens and it's best to be the person you are authetically when that happens also; so don't adapt to a man... find one that is congruent and jives with you now and will 10 yrs into the future.

The clock is ticking? Bah! new medical breathroughs are pushing that back.... be sure of the man first and that takes time.

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by N~still

Actually my past relationships are painful and i don't like to speak of them in an open forum..... I did learn through trial and error exactly what you guys have said. I was incredibly adaptable to my partners; i could always relate and empathize with parts of them but we never jived the the whole outlook and future thing and that is vital. Love and the intimacy of sex will take you into wonderland but one day the ruby slippers will slip off and you wil be back in Kansas again. it's best to be with someone you want to be with when that happens and it's best to be the person you are authetically when that happens also; so don't adapt to a man... find one that is congruent and jives with you now and will 10 yrs into the future.

The clock is ticking? Bah! new medical breathroughs are pushing that back.... be sure of the man first and that takes time.

I do understand N~still. I dated alot of guys ........although ...........dating
was the extent of it. I remained friends with all the guys I dated with the
exception of ONE ...........I prefer to call him PSYCHOGUY ..............

He tried to act like he owned me and I dumped him after 3 dates. The next
thing I knew he was stalking me and has been since 1989.

I know you'll find your significant other .......If I can after dating PSYCHOGUY
....................ANYONE can.

Originally Posted by N~still

The clock is ticking? Bah! new medical breathroughs are pushing that back.... be sure of the man first and that takes time.

Unfortunately that clock is ticking!

Science is great but the reality is that the window for female child birth closes dramatically after 30 and is shut for most by the low 40's.

On top of that for us guys a lot of the fun physical stuff you like to do with our kids becomes much harder to do as we get older. I have a 7 year old and a two year old and can tell I can't do many things as long with my 2 year old. Thank God I am 36 not 46.

If you have any desire to spend time with your Grandkids one day you better have those kids while your young. If you wait to 35 to have kids and so does your daughter you will be lucky to have any quality time with your grandkids.

It's just my opinion but I think society puts too much pressure on people not to commit and find their love when they are young. I met my wonderful wife when I was 16 and married her at 22. I don't think I ever met as many wonderful women as I did in High School and more importantly college. My single friends who were out of college saw the women in their lives at work etc. dramatically shrink and most of the "good" ones soon married.

I remember a lot of nice woman when I was in my low 20s. Now all the nice women I know are married to my friends! My single guy friends have a hard time and it seems even worse for the few single women I know.

Good luck and as President Roslin says, Go make some babies! Humanity still depends on it!

My sentiment... ignore the clock. I got married at 18, had my first child at 19 - and guess what... not an average kid. He's 16 now, and my husband and I are still together (and yes, still very much in love) but I missed a hell of a lot. When other women were dating, I was sitting in PICU with a kid on a ventilator - when my friends were in school, I was getting braces, dealing with hearing aides, and trying to get money for wheelchairs - when my friends were going out to fancy dinners, I was learning what Autism is - and isn't - and just how hard it is to manage when you have a special needs child.

Would I trade it... Hell no! I love my husband, both my boys - but around 30 it hit me that I never DID anything. I graduated HS, went into the AF, got married and had Romie... and then I was a mom. Since then I've gotten a degree, and I teach Autistic kids - but my husband and I never DID stuff... we didn't go to concerts, we don't go out to dinner, we never went dancing... we were too busy raising our kids. It's important - and I love it - but I kinda wish I'd been a me for awhile before I became a wife and mom.

[shiningstar]

I was 35 when I had my oldest child and 36.5 when I had My youngest ..............
like I said before ........I'm glad I waited. I think waiting for the right
guy and WAITING until I was MENTALLY ready to raise a child made me
a better parent.

[Rowan]

Well I ignored the clock, thought I had all the time in the world after all I thought I'm inteligent, caring, hardworking and attractive I won't have any touble finding someone when I'm ready. So I went dancing...a lot, love to dance! had many loves and did many fun things (not all the fun things I would have liked to but) and was totaly free. I just turned 40 a few weeks ago. I would give anything to be someones mom and yes I know there is adoption and it's definitly a consideration but I wanted to experience giving birth at least once, and I would give anything to have found the right man, but frankly I've never met my match, (don't know what I'm supposed to do about that) antelopes right about how didfficult it is to find someone once you get older , school is really the best place, but now all my school mates are 20 years my junior

Sex is ok but I think the build up and romance of the story interests me far more.

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by antelope526

Unfortunately that clock is ticking!

Science is great but the reality is that the window for female child birth closes dramatically after 30 and is shut for most by the low 40's.

On top of that for us guys a lot of the fun physical stuff you like to do with our kids becomes much harder to do as we get older. I have a 7 year old and a two year old and can tell I can't do many things as long with my 2 year old. Thank God I am 36 not 46.

If you have any desire to spend time with your Grandkids one day you better have those kids while your young. If you wait to 35 to have kids and so does your daughter you will be lucky to have any quality time with your grandkids.

It's just my opinion but I think society puts too much pressure on people not to commit and find their love when they are young. I met my wonderful wife when I was 16 and married her at 22. I don't think I ever met as many wonderful women as I did in High School and more importantly college. My single friends who were out of college saw the women in their lives at work etc. dramatically shrink and most of the "good" ones soon married.

I remember a lot of nice woman when I was in my low 20s. Now all the nice women I know are married to my friends! My single guy friends have a hard time and it seems even worse for the few single women I know.

Good luck and as President Roslin says, Go make some babies! Humanity still depends on it!

In my case ........I'd rather my children WAIT until they are MATURE enough
to handle the responsibility of children before they have any theirselves.

That way I may have 'less' time with them but they will have parents who
are ready and willing to give them the type of upbringing that will turn my
grandchildren into productive and HAPPY adults.

And as for President Roslin's Quote ...............TOO many single mothers
have been churning out babies without any thought as to whether
they could MENTALLY or FINANCIALLY raise them.

That's another reason I didn't like the mini ............... quotes like that
send the wrong message.

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by CrysWimmer

My sentiment... ignore the clock. I got married at 18, had my first child at 19 - and guess what... not an average kid. He's 16 now, and my husband and I are still together (and yes, still very much in love) but I missed a hell of a lot. When other women were dating, I was sitting in PICU with a kid on a ventilator - when my friends were in school, I was getting braces, dealing with hearing aides, and trying to get money for wheelchairs - when my friends were going out to fancy dinners, I was learning what Autism is - and isn't - and just how hard it is to manage when you have a special needs child.

Would I trade it... Hell no! I love my husband, both my boys - but around 30 it hit me that I never DID anything. I graduated HS, went into the AF, got married and had Romie... and then I was a mom. Since then I've gotten a degree, and I teach Autistic kids - but my husband and I never DID stuff... we didn't go to concerts, we don't go out to dinner, we never went dancing... we were too busy raising our kids. It's important - and I love it - but I kinda wish I'd been a me for awhile before I became a wife and mom.

That's great CrysWimmer ................I'm glad you and your husband are
still together............ and I'm glad that both of your sons are doing so well.
That speaks volumes as to how strong of a person you are and what a
great wife you are to your husband, and what a wonderful mom you are to
your kids.

[Muffit]

Originally Posted by kat

Sex is ok but I think the build up and romance of the story interests me far more.

Welcome to Colonial Fleets Kat!

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by kat

Sex is ok but I think the build up and romance of the story interests me far more.

Well said kat!

By the way welcome to the colonial fleets

By the time I was 24 I had lived in or been to 18 countries, fought in a war, and was married. I had the travel and adventure but it all never compares to seeing the birth of your kids, reading them stories at night, seeing them grow, watching and coaching them in sports, and all the various things kids do.

My advice: Don't be scared to fall in love in college. Marry your college sweetheart. Wait a couple years to make sure your happy together. After 2-3 years of marriage start to have kids. This will put your first kid around the age of 26. By then you should be a bit grown up. You hopefully had a couple exotic vacations together. You went through the stress of everyday living. If your spouse is a loser you didn't have a kid with them so its still early to start over with NO BAGGAGE (previous kids scare away good men!).

For those who had kids early: Look forward to your vacations in retirement while your still young! At least you won't need a walker to see Big Ben when you finally get to England. If you have kids near 40 they won't be leaving the house till you're near 60.

Good luck to all out there. When I go home tonight I look forward to acting like a bucking bronco for a special two year old boy at home, my son! I will also be helping my seven year old daughter do her homework. Later she'll read to me before she goes to bed.

[shiningstar]

Before I ever met my husband ..........I was already living on my own and had been
for a couple of years. I was already serving in the military as my brother, father,
mother and grandfather along with several, and I do mean SEVERAL other relatives
before me, and I was already a published author (poetry that is) inspite of the fact
that I was told early on that I would be a retard and was not capable of leading
a life of my own.

I have no regrets for waiting for the right person. Waiting for my husband was
the best gift I could have given to myself. For one thing, unlike my friends I did
not put myself at risk for getting sexually transmitted diseases. Some of my
friends caught a few of those. And unfortunately paid for their 'mistake' with
their lives. For another, I didn't waste my time on people who did not respect
me as a person. I waited because I wanted to make certain beyond any
shadow of a doubt that I would be with someone who loved and cared for
me the same way I loved and cared for him.

Is my life OVER because I WAITED until I was 35 to have a child? NO. MY
marriage is secure, and strong. My children are secure in knowing the only
thing they have to worry about is who gets to love them the most. Even though
I am now 43 years old I am hiking, swimming, playing sports. My life
is hardly over. In fact for me .........my life has BARELY begun. Instead of thinking
how old I am ..........I think of how MUCH I have to live for.

I thank God for each and every day that God put me on this earth. I thank him
daily for all the gifts he has given me ......starting with my husband and children.

I know many, many people who laughed at me because I waited so long before
I was EVER with a man. THey're not laughing anymore. Now ........they understand
why I waited for someone who respected me as a person. .... even if they don't
necessarily agree with it.

Originally Posted by shiningstar

I thank God for each and every day that God put me on this earth. I thank him
daily for all the gifts he has given me ......starting with my husband and children.

.

I am with you 100%!

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by antelope526

I am with you 100%!

[Rowan]

Originally Posted by antelope526

My advice: Don't be scared to fall in love in college. Marry your college sweetheart. Wait a couple years to make sure your happy together. After 2-3 years of marriage start to have kids. This will put your first kid around the age of 26. By then you should be a bit grown up. You hopefully had a couple exotic vacations together. You went through the stress of everyday living. If your spouse is a loser you didn't have a kid with them so its still early to start over with NO BAGGAGE (previous kids scare away good men!).

I spent 7 years with my college sweetheart. I was responsible and did not have kids because as it turned out and gradually became apparent he was a mess. I was 28 when I ended it, youg enough to start over, plenty of time ...I thought.
It's because I believed the stament above"previous kids scare away good men" That I've been diligent with birth control until I met the right man but recently I wish I had had them anyways and I'm well aware this is most definitely not the ideal for a child but I can't help how I feal and when I see all my friends with kids and read what shiningstar , crys, and antelope say about their kids it just hurts, because I long for it so much, you are all so unbelievably lucky!

[Muffit]

Don't worry Gaelen... all good things come in time. I'm certain you will get your wish soon and it will be the right time for you.

Once not long ago I thought I would never have children. Each week shopping hurt SO MUCH as I walked down the baby stuff aisle... seeing all the diapers and little jars of food...Always had to fight back the tears.

Now I have my dream of a little girl, and couldn't be happier things worked out in the end.

Your time will come, really it will. Just keep the faith and believe in yourself.

Affectionately,
Muffit

Originally Posted by Gaelen

I spent 7 years with my college sweetheart. I was responsible and did not have kids because as it turned out and gradually became apparent he was a loser. I was 28 when I ended it, youg enough to start over, plenty of time ...I thought.
It's because I believed the stament above"previous kids scare away good men" That I've been diligent with birth control until I met the right man but recently I wish I had had them anyways and I'm well aware this is most definitely not the ideal for a child but I can't help how I feal and when I see all my friends with kids and read what shiningstar , crys, and antelope say about there kids it just hurts, because I long for it so much, you are all so unbelievably lucky!

You're right... I am lucky, and it takes my job to remind me of it some days. My oldest is 16 - with Down syndrome, Epilepsy, Autism, Neural Deafness, Heart problems, Neurological problems, Orthopedic problems... and believe it or not I think God for him every day. He's a good kid... and I don't have to worry about the wrong crowd at school, getting him a car, or who his girlfriend is <g>.

My youngest is just this side of brilliant, completely socially inept, and a severe end ADHD (with emphesis on the hyperactivity and impulsivity). I've been to the principal's office 3 times in 3 weeks, and while he has As and Bs in academics, he has more Not satisfactories than Satisfactories in Behaviour and Citizenship. Oh well... he's a good kid... I think <g>.

I wanted eight children. I wanted to marry a doctor, have a big house, and just be a mom. Life didnt work out that way, but we take what we have. I wound up teaching kids with problems far more severe than what my kids manage, and I love it. Maybe that could be a partial solution for you... volunteer in your church nursery, spend time at a daycare... do something to work with kids. It's not the same... not at all... but it helps fill the hole some days.

I would have loved to have had a little girl, but after chasing pony-tail clips on one of my students for the last two years... y'know, I'm glad she's someone else's <g>.

::hugs::

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by Gaelen

I spent 7 years with my college sweetheart. I was responsible and did not have kids because as it turned out and gradually became apparent he was a loser. I was 28 when I ended it, youg enough to start over, plenty of time ...I thought.
It's because I believed the stament above"previous kids scare away good men" That I've been diligent with birth control until I met the right man but recently I wish I had had them anyways and I'm well aware this is most definitely not the ideal for a child but I can't help how I feal and when I see all my friends with kids and read what shiningstar , crys, and antelope say about there kids it just hurts, because I long for it so much, you are all so unbelievably lucky!

It's not too late for you to have kids Gaelen. It's never too late.
I'm just glad I waited. Unfortunately ...........or fortunately I wasn't ready to
have kids when I was in my 20's. You're still young ...........when you're
ready to have kids ............. you will.

[shiningstar]

Read Muffit's post to you ..........she's right you know.

[Rowan]

Thanks guys somedays are really hard! I think I must have felt low that day. I appreciate all your kind words, sensitivity and support.
But Crys holly cow! I had no Idea, that is quite the challenge. I always wanted to have 8 kids too, 4 boys and 4 girls. I come from a family that has many kids. My great grandmother raised 26, my grandmother raised 16 ,I have 67 first cousins on my fathers side alone. As for working around kids it's very painful for me right now to be around them I crave it and I dread it. I get along like gangbusters with kids, just a big kid at heart. If I go to a party you won't find me with the adults. But most of the time the longing is so intense and profound I usulally don't deliberately seek out their company.

Thanks guys

[shiningstar]

Originally Posted by Gaelen

Thanks guys somedays are really hard! I think I must have felt low that day. I appreciate all your kind words, sensitivity and support.
But Crys holly cow! I had no Idea, that is quite the challenge. I always wanted to have 8 kids too, 4 boys and 4 girls. I come from a family that has many kids. My great grandmother raised 26, my grandmother raised 16 ,I have 67 first cousins on my fathers side alone. As for working around kids it's very painful for me right now to be around them I crave it and I dread it. I get along like gangbusters with kids, just a big kid at heart. If I go to a party you won't find me with the adults. But most of the time the longing is so intense and profound I usulally don't deliberately seek out their company.

Thanks guys

(((((((((((((((GAELEN))))))))))))))))))

Just hang in there. When you are ready for kids it will happen.

I remember when we started to 'try' for kids a couple of years after
we were married. I was the same way.

I had been afraid that it would never happen when I wasn't pregnate
a year after we started trying .................. but it did 'happen' for me;
and it WILL happen for you

[unowhoandwhy]

Originally Posted by Gaelen

Thanks guys somedays are really hard!

Gaelen, I certainly know how you feel. I'm 31 and have finally (in the past year or so) decided that I would like to settle down with a nice guy and have a child or two. Now I just have to ffind the nice guy, which is a more difficult task than I thought.

Until then, I will have a little niece or nephew to spoil this Septwember (which might be more fun as I can spoil him or her and then return him or her when she is bad! Hey, my aunts did it with me, that's what aunties are for!) My sister (half sister, actually, we have the same mother, but we are very close even though we grew up in separate homes) just found out a few weeks ago and we are all so excited because it will be the first child born in my mother's family since my cousin was born 16 years ago!

As for waiting till you're older, that's a personal choice. Everyone is ready at a different time. My mother was shocked discover at the age of 17 that it really did only take just one time to get pregnant. We ended up raising each other, which is not a healthy thing. We are close now, but it was a long and hard road to that place and I swore I would never do that to a child.

But, 'nuff about me. It's funny, we were having the same "I can't find any nice men/women with similar interests" discussion on a Star Trek list I belong to just last week! Maybe us singletons should start a SciFi singles Yahoo group and commiserate with each other!