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Old December 8th, 2003, 11:39 PM   #1
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Default I LOVE IT !!! Now read to see why.

Ok...Here we go...I TOTALLY disagree with just about everyone's point of view here.

This was never intended to be a remake of BSG, not by a longshot. This series is a total rethink...Isn't that what the studio said in the first place??? It is meant to portray a more "realistic" type of environment. As they are human, and are our future decendants, many things would be similar between them and us. Funny thing is, their technology only seems about 300 years beyond ours. This could suggest an earthly holocaust and subsequent 2nd dark-age. Only after people and the planet recovered did they focus their efforts on colonizing other planets. Thus the 12 colonies of Cobol came to be.

Lets hit some high points, shall we???

1. Newtonian space physics (action-reaction) The fact that we finally have ships and fighters that DON'T fly like aircraft in space is a welcome departure.

2. The crews and ship have a realistic-type functionality. Ground-crews wear high-vis, flame retarding uniforms, the pilots wear G-suits to counter the effects of high-G load manuvering, and their helmets actually FIT and are PRESSURIZED !!!! Compared to the first series, the uniforms are a MAJOR leap in functionality and style. Also, the ship seems very much arranged like a modern naval vessel. Quite unlike the ships of yore.

3. Thermonuclear weapons...enough said.

4. Boomer is cool, and hot.

5. Having the Raptor as an AWACS-type ship is a novel concept for space combat. I like the idea of a command and control type vessel that guides the fighters.

6. No "TURBO" button on a stick with ONLY three buttons. The cockpits are VERY clean and high tech in this go-around. Quite unlike the uber-cheese cockpits of the original.

7. Baltar is a fall-guy and NOT some yammering / crazed villian. He had a very human weakness, and it was his downfall. Quite Greek-Tragedy, don't you think ???

8. Adama isn't like Loren Greene, however he is a stern and complex man, I respect that. Olmos reminds me of one of my former Commanding Officers.

Now for the cons:

1. Starbuck REALLY needed to be a guy...but oh well, maybe she'll learn not to act like such a petulant child.

2. Apollo hasn't had much character development yet. I think this could be saved for a future episode.

3. The "president" is horribly annoying. However she does recapture the frustration you felt with the councel of wusses in the first series. (ie. Adama ALWAYS trying to convince the council not be be such cowards)

4. The music. Look...I like the whole military drumline thing...but this series needs a defining themesong, and good music for battle-scenes. The drums are more than welcome to stay...but we need music.






So...I could yammer on and on...but I'd like to say this: Give it a chance. Treat it as if it was a WHOLE NEW SERIES. Because honestly, it is. I like it because I was a HUGE fan of [Space: Above and Beyond™]. And these seem very similar. They seemed to of let some of the mystical out and traded it for more of a raw, military-type feel. Both old and new approaches work, it's just that you have to get used to this new one.

So give the new Battlestar Galactica a chance, 'Cause we haven't even seen the 2nd half !

Last edited by Spectre; December 8th, 2003 at 11:51 PM..
 
Old December 8th, 2003, 11:48 PM   #2
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Default Yo

You are sooo on the money....this is like watching all the best Anime I have ever seen...it is soooo not like the old BSG...it is very dark and serious.......it really rocks......

I think it even does better than B5........and is light years ahead of StarTrek....and Star wars......it is just so real......
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Old December 8th, 2003, 11:55 PM   #3
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Thanks Dec5.

I went poking around the 'net after the show...looking for a forum to talk in about this show...so here I am!

I understand the folks who want the old BSG back...Hell I LOVED the original Starbuck and Apollo. I grew up watching BSG as a kid...but this new series is totally intended to be different.

I wish the old-school fans weren't so harsh, as it's a wonder we get ANY good SciFi shows these days in an age of hip-hop idiocy.

Message for the "Old-Schoolers"

Be harsh..slam the show...write hate mail, knash teeth, go ahead and have a ball!!! When there's nothing but silly reality TV shows and MTV left, the ones to blame would be yourselves.
 
Old December 9th, 2003, 12:11 AM   #4
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Default Same here....

I am a huge Athena fan......and I really am hardcore about the first 3 or 4 eppys of the original series.......


The only draw back about this new series being so good is that the original series that I grew up with and really liked will take longer to be made....if ever....

I still love Richard Hatch's version above all others.....but I doubt Glen Larson will ever want to work with Richard's vision.....
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Old December 9th, 2003, 12:19 AM   #5
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Hmm. Us "old-schoolers" as you call us like Farscape and Firefly, whose worst written episode could blow the pogees out of this miniseries on the basis of dialogue alone.

Reality TV and MTV are 2 things I do not watch. But I'm not in Ms. Bonnie's target market, quite possibly you are.

Spectre, you are welcome to state your opinion, but please do not try to flame or antagonize the TOS fans here. We have fought a lengthy war and this is the death throes for part one of that fight. Part two starts when the mini finishes.

The real Galactica will rise again!
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Old December 9th, 2003, 12:25 AM   #6
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Default Firefly

Firefly was cool......and it is great that it is coming back...
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Old December 9th, 2003, 12:27 AM   #7
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Well, as a college educated aviator...I don't exactly watch Sesame Street anymore.

This new show is smart, and well written. Sure it's got rough spots..but what doesn't??? Oh yeah...thats right, the old show was perfect !

Geez...I bet you even want all the guys to have '70's hockey hair !
 
Old December 9th, 2003, 12:41 AM   #8
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hehe, "hockey" hair. didn't know that hockey players had their own style.


Like the mini's hairstylists were an improvement? Let me know 25 years from now.... then we can compare notes!
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Old December 9th, 2003, 12:47 AM   #9
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I'm not opposed to the old show AT ALL...just so you know. I simply would like folks to give the new one a chance on it's own merit.

That and I kinda have a crush on the new boomer.
 
Old December 9th, 2003, 12:59 AM   #10
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Spectre, there's been a leaked script out since last January; we've known about Stardoe since exactly a year ago this past week....quite possibly this fan base has more pre-broadcast information about a production than any fanbase ever.

Add in that Universal forgot they owned Galactica until 1996-7 when fans rekindled a fight to get her on the air again--as a continuation with original cast and storyline, set 20+ yahren after the final TV episode; and you will find this fanbase has had a bitter pill to swallow in the last year.

Meantime a real movie project based on the old series' actual storyline waits in the wings for this to air. Most of us will be supporting that however we can.

Lot's of guys like the new boomer. Just like lots of us gals are not happy with the Kara character's call sign. There is only one Starbuck for us, played by a guy named Dirk.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 01:53 AM   #11
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okay spectre, no insults about the hair or other things like that. You are acting a little trollish in some of your comments. No bashing of the old show to make room for the mini please. You take cheap shots at the old show, and people will fire back.

The old show is king.

I do agree you very much on most of your post. I wrote a review a couple of weeks ago. We are having a similiar take on it. Though I'm not a great fan of it.



The hair is not a good criticism. Its more of an insult. True the hair dates the show. But then they wouldn't be remaking the show with the same hairstyle right? To discount it because of the hairstyle matches the time period it was made is to say 2001 is a crappy movie cause it uses the PAN AM logo even though we know in the 80s that company went bankrupt.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 02:47 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by conundrum7g
okay spectre, no insults about the hair or other things like that. You are acting a little trollish in some of your comments. No bashing of the old show to make room for the mini please. You take cheap shots at the old show, and people will fire back.

The old show is king.

I do agree you very much on most of your post. I wrote a review a couple of weeks ago. We are having a similiar take on it. Though I'm not a great fan of it.



The hair is not a good criticism. Its more of an insult. True the hair dates the show. But then they wouldn't be remaking the show with the same hairstyle right? To discount it because of the hairstyle matches the time period it was made is to say 2001 is a crappy movie cause it uses the PAN AM logo even though we know in the 80s that company went bankrupt.
Well, considering I was looking for somewhere to discuss the mini after I saw it...I think I may of landed right in the "bigtime older BSG fan" camp.

I've looked both left and right...I know where I am.

Like I said, I'm a HUGE fan of the old show...However I didn't realize the amount of controversy surrounding the CIRCUMSTANCES of the new show. I didn't know a more "true to the old one" version was in the works and then got scrapped for the "rethink."

In that light, I can empathize and TOTALLY agree with most of your folks viewpoints.

However...since I am probably a bit more impartial. (Been away from BSG since '80) I'm viewing the new show without any of the controversial backstory in my head.

Perhaps by NOT knowing about the strife and toil the BSG fan-community has been through I was able to better enjoy the new one???

Less emotional baggage on my part I suppose. But then again, I really wanted a Space: Above and Beyond movie anyhow. This is pretty close
 
Old December 9th, 2003, 02:48 AM   #13
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1. when is firefly coming back out.
2. New NG is a lot better than most shows on TV. Especially reality shows.
3. Please don't insult music that you don't like. I don't like country music but I don't knock it.
4. Why are so many people having a problem with the sexual content of this show. As a Naval Officer, I can safely say that some amount of sexual activity however prohibited does go on behind closed doors.
5. There are a few times when an XO might end up playing cards with the wardroom. But not right before a decommissioning ceremony, that the XO would be one of the busiest men on the ship.
6. This is not much of a multi racial cast. I think that the miix should either be balanced along the lines of the matrix or just changed to say that caucasians don't always come out on top.
7. I like the show but I was hoping that this would be a human culture with different customs. These people are descended from Earth after 110 B.C. (China) 113 A.D. (Roman) or 1650 France depending on who actually originated the wearing of ties.
Overall
I like the show as science fiction. I would prefer it to be named something other than BG, but hey if we don't support this we'll be left with MIB VII or some other garbage.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 06:59 AM   #14
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Spec Had they made this using Richards story with the same FX it would have been spectacular. The circumstances and FX were quite different in 78.
If you want this to stand on it own merets, it should have been called something else
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Old December 9th, 2003, 08:32 AM   #15
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I am a huge fan of the original but I looked at the mini on it's own merits. As an original work it fails in all departments. The plot was slow and boring. Nothing was shown, it was only talked about. The destruction of the Atlantia? Not shown. The destruction of the Colonies? Not shown. (OK, a few mushroom clouds, big deal.) Everyone was unlikeable. Thrace was cruel to Tigh by rubbing in his marital problems. Tigh was a miserable drunk. Lee Adama was a whiney loser that hated his father. And so on and so forth. The sets and costumes looked cheap. Transforming the cylons from robots into playboy centerfolds reeks of cost cutting. Making Cylon outfits or CGI cylons? Expensive. Exploiting women for crass titilation? That's cheap. The music was just a series of colorless tones rather than an actual score. The special effects were too dark and you could not see what was going on. The Galactica looked like a toy rather than a massive ship of war. Oh yea, I almost forgot. Rather than write interesting dialog, put in tons of sex sceans. Ron D. Moore wanted to reinvent science fiction television. That's fine. He can create his own show. Instead, he hijacked Battlestar Galactica. I sincerly hope that the mini is not picked up as an ongoing series.
 
Old December 9th, 2003, 08:37 AM   #16
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Default Pros and Cons

I have not seen all the mini yet (Monday Night Football was on) but...

Nukes? That's a positive? Aside from the EMP issues (since the Cylons are machines) why is this good? I am to believe a society that can build a FTL spacecraft carrier with hundreds of fighters, but the best the bad guys come up with is Nukes? Why weren't nukes used to destroy the fleet then? Just curious

I am also amazed by people who poke at the 70s costume and style of the original, but like the new one beacause "Boomer is hot." 25 years ago "Starbuck was hot", but that didn't make the show good, bad or indifferent.

From what I saw (about 10 minutes or so) the effercts were done pretty well. I liked the New red eyed cylons in the station shot, but their movements were a bit jerky. The CGI could have been done better. The base star was improessive and I don't dislike the Galactica.

I'll reserve comments on the rest until I have actually seen the show.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 10:21 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bijou88
I am a huge fan of the original but I looked at the mini on it's own merits. As an original work it fails in all departments. The plot was slow and boring. Nothing was shown, it was only talked about. The destruction of the Atlantia? Not shown. The destruction of the Colonies? Not shown. (OK, a few mushroom clouds, big deal.) Everyone was unlikeable. Thrace was cruel to Tigh by rubbing in his marital problems. Tigh was a miserable drunk. Lee Adama was a whiney loser that hated his father. And so on and so forth. The sets and costumes looked cheap. Transforming the cylons from robots into playboy centerfolds reeks of cost cutting. Making Cylon outfits or CGI cylons? Expensive. Exploiting women for crass titilation? That's cheap. The music was just a series of colorless tones rather than an actual score. The special effects were too dark and you could not see what was going on. The Galactica looked like a toy rather than a massive ship of war. Oh yea, I almost forgot. Rather than write interesting dialog, put in tons of sex sceans. Ron D. Moore wanted to reinvent science fiction television. That's fine. He can create his own show. Instead, he hijacked Battlestar Galactica. I sincerly hope that the mini is not picked up as an ongoing series.
Yes I have to agree with you on this one. To me it didn't fly as a Sci-Fi show, and it really didn't fly BATTLESTAR GALACTICA.

The thing I liked the most was how the Mark 2 Vipers flew, with the little jets manuevering it much like the Space Shuttle, and with the command ship plotting the position of the enemy.

Yes Boomer is amazingly cute, but her character is nothing like the Boomer from the original series. In fact to me nothing in this is like the original series. Even changing the characters names from the old series to be the call signs seems completely lame to me.

And I wasn't a big fan of the bridge. Maybe it was just how it was shot, but I couldn't tell where anything was.

I did like the realistic addition of the ground support crews of the craft, who were barely in the old series, but to me this as a whole is a failure, especially when we could have had a continuation of the old series with the original actors being part of it.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 10:29 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Spectre
Message for the "Old-Schoolers"

Be harsh..slam the show...write hate mail, knash teeth, go ahead and have a ball!!! When there's nothing but silly reality TV shows and MTV left, the ones to blame would be yourselves.
Message to Spectre

You seem to be angry with us not for anything we've said about you, but about what we're saying about the mini series. If you want to praise it, fine, but learn how to praise without attacking people who disagree with you.

Last edited by RGrant; December 10th, 2003 at 10:14 PM..
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Old December 9th, 2003, 11:52 AM   #19
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Guys, I think we got through to Spectre, just give him a couple of days to read up on what we almost had and he'll realize why we weren't into a remake of SAAB when they slapped BG's name on it.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 04:13 PM   #20
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Is the new bg just a two part show? Is that all they are giving us? I love it and think its great. I loved the old one and watched it. The haters are just haters it could have been an line for line remake and they would have still picked it apart.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 04:34 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by rincon
Is the new bg just a two part show? Is that all they are giving us? I love it and think its great. I loved the old one and watched it. The haters are just haters it could have been an line for line remake and they would have still picked it apart.
I hate the mini, will not watch another moment of it, but I'm not going to beat up on anybody who enjoyed it. I may question their intelligence, but...

(that was a jab at a couple friends of mine, rincon).

No, I hate the mini for what it did (and didn't do) to a franchise that could have been as big as Star Trek. There are those who disagree with me - that's fine, I'm used to that and I don't hold it against them.

But, if you think the mini is the greatest thing since sex (there was enough of that in there), I'm happy for you. But read some of the reviews that have been posted around (by reputable reviewers - I'd avoid Skiffy if I were you), and you'll find all sorts of opinions.

Mine is that it wasn't Battlestar Galactica.

Big surprise, right?

But, rather than butting my head into that brick wall, I'm busy writing a letter endorsing a big-screen continuation. The mini can quickly grace certain nether regions of the metaphysical plane as far as I'm concerned.

I know the word 'rincon', rincon. Where are you from?

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Old December 9th, 2003, 04:37 PM   #22
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Please rincon, if you really believe that, this may be the wrong place for you. Perhaps if you understood more why we feel the way we do, you could would understand why many here do not like the mini
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Old December 9th, 2003, 05:03 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Metro6371
1. when is firefly coming back out.
According to Dark Horizons the possibilty of a movie has at the least been delayed.
Quote:
Two no longer with us shows, one an 80's icon and the other a short lived recent sci-fi series, are both looking to have ill-fated futures on the big screen according to the latest TV Guide.

Even though the lavish DVD set for his defunct "Firefly" show comes out today, "Buffy" creator Joss Whedon confirmed that it seems the big-screen incarnation of the western/sci-fi series has been hit a snag - it looks like it may happen but don't expect much in the way of speed.

Whedon says "I have interest, I have hope, but I have no news. I can't really talk about it. When there is news, I will [tell you]. But if I start talking about it before there is [anything definitive to say], it lessens the chance that [it will get made]. Assuming it actually happens — which I cannot — yeah, the idea is I'm trying to write a movie that everybody who hasn't seen the show could enjoy, but that doesn't repeat anything that we have seen on the show".
Not Battlestar News, but it was asked here, so I thought I would share the news.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 08:23 PM   #24
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Wow talk about alot of bitter poeple. I loved the new version, and I have my reasons, the same way that I loved the old series, which quite honestly was just as flawed.

A comment was made about the hockey hair of the original series and that made me laugh, but the response to that comment really got me. Take a look at the current military, and the haircuts they they had were perfect. I am active duty navy, have been for 9 years, and that is what I see day in and day out. Well except for allowing females to wear ponytails, that is all sorts of against regs, it can easily become a hazard.

What I loved about the new series is that it was by far more realistic then the original. I've been on two ships, an old Submarine that was getting ready for decom when I reported, and a Cruiser. And you know what, they way things looked on the Galactic was perfect. It wasn't too advanced, it looked like an aged ship, and the realism is what drew me in, especially since I've been there and done that. The old wired phones, the damage control displays, the comm printouts, the layout of the bridge and all of that. Hell even the uniforms made more sense, flight crew having different colors then the pilots, you should go online and check out the flight crew uniforms that sailors use on aircraft carriers now. They are very similiar. The use of call signs makes a bit more sense, and eliviates the cheese factor that the original series had, and makes the mini feel more realistic. Again look at the current military, they seem to have based alot of it on that. Though I do have to say that someone needs to teach these guys how to salute, god that kills me.

I do think it was a bit oversexed. But hey sex sells. Now I am a twenty-something male. Trust me I love sex, the more the better, but I didn't want it here. The beginning scene was pretty much useless, the one between the chief and boomer was interesting and believe me it does happen. The idea of integrated male and female military/cast was a good idea too. that is what the current military is moving towards, so why not show that in some future world that it has been done and works well.

Now I do have the original mini-series and full series on DVD, and I do love it. But don't make it out to be some sort of a god that nothing else will ever live up to. It was flawed, the acting wasn't that great at times, some of the episodes were down right cheesy, but I loved it then and I still do now.

Quite honestly I feel that if this show had been given a different name, and different character names were used that it wouldn't be getting beat up as much. Give it a chance, it is supposed to be a complete retelling, therefor it is supposed to be completely different. The character are different on purpose, they are not at all supposed to be like the original series, that is the whole point that alot of you seem to not be seeing. From reading alot of the posts, and whether alot of you realise it or not, you are coming off as if you had your opinion of this formed before you even saw it. Give it a chance, it isn't perfect, but nothing ever is at first. All the first few episodes of all the trek series for instance were flawed, but got better with time.

It actually reminded me alot of the series Above and Beyond, or something like that which was out a few years ago. Just thought I would throw that in.

OK well there is my opinion for now. I might have more to say at another time, or I may not, depends on what is said after this. It's just my opinion, it's how things appear though my eyes.

Let the abuse begin ;-)
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Old December 9th, 2003, 08:30 PM   #25
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No abuse from me, zona75. Welcome to the Fleets.

You have a point of reference for the mini that makes it more enjoyable for you than it does for me. And I fully agree, if they hadn't used the BSG name and character names it would not be as controversial as it is.

But part of my reaction is to the slap in the face the production of this has been to the fans who have been clamoring for a revival for 25 years. Nothing that has been said or done by the fans, the core audience, was considered; rather, the arrogance, the "my way is the only way" attitude, dismissive of what so many have worked for, and for so long, was the rule of the day. It's very hard not to be resentful of being ignored after so long.

I'm glad you enjoyed it - there's so little science fiction on TV now.

I'm supporting a big screen continuation. You'd be welcome to join us.

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Old December 9th, 2003, 10:30 PM   #26
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Default Welcome, zona75

Welcome, zona75

I enjoyed reading your post. That's the best things I've heard so far about the mini. Can't say I agree, but that's because I thought it was the worst directing I've ever seen. And, I was not wanting a "reality" space show. One of the main reasons I like science fiction is because it's an escape from this reality that we live in. So, yes, they should have called it something else and we probably would be "on board" with you. Until they change the name I've got to keep saying: Long live the original and may it rise again!
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Old December 9th, 2003, 11:18 PM   #27
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Count me among those that liked it while also being a huge fan of the original. I realize that some things HAD to be changed in order to make the new show fiit the times but I still can't get over Starbuck being a woman nor do I even like the character.

What I find really odd though is that I feel so insulted at the sex change of the character yet the writer made sure to pay homage to the original in so many other caring ways such as the original cylon design, the tidbits of theme music, the original viper design or close to it, the 'By your command line'
and a few more I can't think of.

As much as there is bashing for the new show there was a lot wrong with TOS as well. Why were there THREE Cylon pilots in a cylon fighter? If they were so advanced why have any pilot? That was just one issue that was addressed.

If TOS was done today as it was then it would be considered corny and hokey by non-fans of sci-fi. I think the mini can really draw out non sci-fi fans as well.

On a related note I am glad for the forum addition but I notice some bickering already that is making me uneasy. I hope this will not continue as I will not feel comfortable posting here. The way I see it is there are going to be a lot of fans coming in here to argue with the people that liked it.
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Old December 9th, 2003, 11:41 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dean Martin As much as there is bashing for the new show there was a lot wrong with TOS as well. Why were there THREE Cylon pilots in a cylon fighter? If they were so advanced why have any pilot? That was just one issue that was addressed.
Well for one thing, the cyclons were orignally supposed to be a reptillian race, so perhaps they still had a reptile brain in them, and were used to mobile, pibed form, not the form of a ship. This was a race that evolved, not created by humans, as the new series does.

The more I see Starbuck the more I hate her. She isn't a good actress. She isn't cute, and her part is really badly written. And that save of Apollo was silly and ridiculous. Those suits look like they are air tight, why not go EVA, and hold on, or get into her ship, that was just stupid.
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Old December 10th, 2003, 12:02 AM   #29
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Sure you can always come up with reasons for things that go outside the show but my point is, you can find wrong in anything.
I for one would like to hear at least one positive comment about the series. Most people seem to agree that the newly designed cylons looked cool.
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Old December 10th, 2003, 12:54 AM   #30
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I've noticed something from just about every positive post here. It is followed by some bewildered old school fan who has to knock either the taste in said posters name, or say how unintelligent they are. People will like what they like. If you have a qualm on what should be on T.V. get off the computer, and go turn your T.V. off. No one that watched the mini was forced to do so. And if you are so worried that it may become a series, don't watch it. Then you will see it take the same fate as the origional. Then the younger fans 20 years from now can crusade to have another re-make made.
BTW i am a fan of the orgional and yes i do like the new mini. The difference, with myself I guess, was the understanding that characters won't be as flawless as the origional. My perception accounts for a character in a 4 hour mini, versus 20+ hours of the origional.
I read someone complaining that the landing bays retracted. If memory serves me right, didn't most of the battlestars in the origional fall to a 70's sci-fi explosion from fighters crashing into the landing bays? Now if you did a remake, wouldn't you remove that little flaw in ship design?
And the nukes. Why nukes? why not? Sorry in the origional series I couldn't quite picture tons of fighters taking out 12 planets worth of people. This is genocide remember?
Bad CGI on the actual robots too? It still looked better than guys in shiny suits.
Don't get me wrong. I am a fan of all....
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