Anyone remember the "daisy" commercial?

January 1st, 2004, 12:28 AM

I noticed a certain resemblance between the little girl plucking at her doll as her ship was about to be destroyed, and the Barry Goldwater-Lyndon Johnson commercial that aired once during the 64 campaign (I was a very little girl! - but the ad has been reshown as an example).

In it, a little girl was, I believe, picking petals off a daisy just as deliberately, just before the screen went bright (as in a nuclear explosion). I've only seen the commercial maybe 3-4x, but, man, do I feel like this scene evokes that "I've seen this before" feeling. Even as a youn'un, I was convinced Barry Goldwater would plunge us into nuclear extinction, especially with a babysitter who once said she thought humanity would be alll but destroyed before I reached adulthood.

Anyone else?

Sept17th · January 1st, 2004, 01:01 AM

I had no doubts that scene and Sci-Fi promo was based on the "daisy commercial". I would be floored if it were coincidence.

Dennis · January 1st, 2004, 07:20 AM

I think it's deliberate, yeah. Moore pulled a couple of rather stark images from events in the early 1960s -- in describing Roslin's swearing-in about Colonial One, the script explicitly references the photos of LBJ taking the oath of office of the Presidency on the plane back from Dallas.

Darth Marley · January 1st, 2004, 07:35 AM

Ya,I spotted the daisy.

What really gets me is,no one complains the girl got nuked,but snap an infant's neck....

Westy · January 2nd, 2004, 04:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Darth Marley
What really gets me is,no one complains the girl got nuked,but snap an infant's neck....

The didn't show the girl screaming as she vaporized into a burnt and discusting corpse before our eyes did they? No....they did however show 6 reaching in and snapping the neck and we the viewers got the benefit of hearing it in all it's digital mastery. If they showed the girl or at least played the sound effect of her body exploding with various wet gooey parts hitting the decks, I'm sure the fans would have complained.

Yminale · January 2nd, 2004, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Westy
The didn't show the girl screaming as she vaporized into a burnt and discusting corpse before our eyes did they? No....they did however show 6 reaching in and snapping the neck and we the viewers got the benefit of hearing it in all it's digital mastery. If they showed the girl or at least played the sound effect of her body exploding with various wet gooey parts hitting the decks, I'm sure the fans would have complained.

:confused:

So it's Ok when adults scream out in terror, planets get nuked and the poor girl to literally flash out of existence, but a simple *SNAP* drives everybody crazy ?! I think anti-mini people need to get a wider perspective instead of focusing on small details.

BST · January 2nd, 2004, 07:38 AM

Quote:

So it's Ok when adults scream out in terror, planets get nuked and the poor girl to literally flash out of existence, but a simple *SNAP* drives everybody crazy ?! I think anti-mini people need to get a wider perspective instead of focusing on small details.

Wasn't it enough to have "adults scream out in terror, planets get nuked and the poor girl to literally flash out of existence"?

What useful purpose did the baby-killing serve?

Wasn't planetary devastation by nuclear weapons and ships being destroyed sufficient to portray that people were killed?

malachi42 · January 2nd, 2004, 07:55 AM

Wasn't planetary devastation by nuclear weapons and ships being destroyed sufficient to portray that people were killed?

I'd say the answer to that is no, since no one is expressing any horror about it. I have yet to read any post on any board expressing horror about depicting genocide.

BST · January 2nd, 2004, 08:03 AM

:confused: :confused:

I must be missing something. Does the fact that people are being killed ONLY occur when they are shown going through their death throes?

Getting back to the other question:

What useful purpose did the baby-killing serve?

Yminale · January 2nd, 2004, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BST
:confused: :confused:

I must be missing something. Does the fact that people are being killed ONLY occur when they are shown going through their death throes?

Getting back to the other question:

What useful purpose did the baby-killing serve?

http://www.colonialfleets.com/forums...&threadid=5738

And just because you don't acknowledge the dramatic potential doesn't mean there isn't one.

BST · January 2nd, 2004, 09:18 AM

Yminale,

I'm sorry that I won't be able to respond to this. I respect your choice and others about watching and enjoying the mini. We may disagree on certain plot points and scenes, etc, and that's fine. I don't want any thoughts that I may have about the mini to be disruptive to anyone that enjoyed it.

BST

Darth Marley · January 2nd, 2004, 09:33 AM

Ah,ever the diplomat.

We do seem to have to accept agreeing to disagree.The culture war plays out on many fronts.

Even so,discussion and disagreement serves to enrich our collective understanding.

BST · January 2nd, 2004, 09:37 AM

Thanks, Darth.

I'm trying but, it ain't easy!!

Yminale · January 2nd, 2004, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BST
Yminale,

I'm sorry that I won't be able to respond to this. I respect your choice and others about watching and enjoying the mini. We may disagree on certain plot points and scenes, etc, and that's fine. I don't want any thoughts that I may have about the mini to be disruptive to anyone that enjoyed it.

BST

I don't mind arguing about dramatic content but people have been using this scene as a moral litmus test. aka If you are pro-mini, you are pro-baby killing which is really sick. I think the scene is important because the Cylons were too "safe" in the orignal series. You simply didn't have an emotional reaction to them. Now you have an almost viceral reaction to them (Cylons are baby killers DIE DIE DIE). I feel that's a big improvement. Setting up emotional connections are just as important as stating a bunch of plot points.

January 2nd, 2004, 01:07 PM

In the "Saga of a Star World" pilot version where Baltar is killed not spared, the Imperious Leader tells a centurian to kill Baltar. The centurian draws a SWORD. The scene ends right before we would have seen his beheading. The viewer is left to know that among other things the survivors on the homeworlds will be slaughtered like cattle. I don't know if the baby scene should have been left in the movie, but physically killing by hand or sharpened blade especially of an innocent leaves a deep impression. I think Larson tried to leave that impression in the original but television convention at the time limited what he could do. Moore just went one step beyond in a world where you can put most anything on TV.

The most personally disturbing movie scene I have ever seen was watching the soldier in Saving Private Ryan stabbed and killed as the German soldier tries to keep him quiet and tell him its OK. For some reason when death is impersonal it does not bother you the same way. I think in Ryan and Battlestar those one on one personal scenes convey a horror that all the bullets and nuclear bombs just can't make.

January 2nd, 2004, 01:35 PM

You know, I hadn't thought of it before, but now that you mention it, it does look like that ad.

If I remember correctly, someone did an updated version of that ad in 2000 against Bush.

Darth Marley · January 2nd, 2004, 01:59 PM

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/0116-06.htm

it was an anti-war ad by folks that thought we should "move on" and get over the impeachment of Clinton,but just can't seem to "move on" from Gore's loss.
Not a group I have much respect for if you couldn't tell.

January 5th, 2004, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BST
I must be missing something. Does the fact that people are being killed ONLY occur when they are shown going through their death throes?

Actually, yes. Indeed, one truly horrifying thing about the miniseries is that people are so blase about genocide and so up-in-arms about a single death.

The best drama does not merely take place on its stage but makes the audience to participate, even unwittingly. This is one instance wherein that happened. Shocked and horrified at one death, blase and unmoved by genocide.

How does the saw go?
Kill one person, you're a murderer.
Kill a billion people, you're a statesman.

BST · January 5th, 2004, 02:59 PM

Dogface,

I personally feel that people are more affected by the murder of a baby than an adult or grown child because the baby is defenseless, especially an infant.

Good points, though.

BST

January 5th, 2004, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BST
[B]Dogface,

I personally feel that people are more affected by the murder of a baby than an adult or grown child because the baby is defenseless, especially an infant.

And that is another reason to keep the scene in. The audience is supposed to hate the Cylons. I mis-type.

The audience is supposed to HATE the Cylons. I'm certain that the way that people can easily dismiss a great tragedy in drama was known to the developers. Thus, something had to be done to make it clear that the Cylons were to be feared and that no quarter could be expected.

100 billion people die. Ho hum, an incomprehensible number that is cleanly reported with no muss, no fuss, no dirty yellow buildup.

One baby is killed. Now it's personal.

Of course, the fact that such a difference in dramatic effect in perfect inverse to the magnitude of a horror again speaks to my original post on this.

shiningstar · January 5th, 2004, 04:58 PM

I remember the Daisy commercial and YES after reading
the Mini series script I immediately saw the resembelence..