Small request.... I think we all know....

[Micheleh]

...the prevailing opinion of one Mr. RDM. Can we go back to posting about the things we like without every other sentence being about that? This is just a request- some people here actually like his older work, but whether you do or not, I am humbly requesting that we give a bit less post time to the negative remarks. I read a few posts this morning, and I know they had subjects, but the part I remember is the negative comparisons about RDM. (Or Milton, or whoever...) I just don't like seeing someone get so much attention through negative behavior, lol.

Anyway, that's only a personal request. I'm enjoying the recent posts, I would just enjoy them more without the obligatory pot-shot.

Thank you very much!

[Stevew]

When someone attacks Michael or anybody else with an untruth, I am compelled to defend them.
S:mad:

[LordStarFyre]

We have the SFC Board which is primarily a Madhouse, with Trolls and Clones o'plenty.

We have Milty's Board which is Pro-Moore, and fairly Anti TOS.

We have Cylon Alliance which is Venting Port, for BOTH.

Are we to assume by your Request that CF is totally Neutral or Moore Complimentary only?

Just curious...

[Micheleh]

"When someone attacks Michael or anybody else with an untruth, I am compelled to defend them."

That's cool. I'm just referring to "Hey, this is great, not that so and so would ever understand" sort of thing.

"Are we to assume by your Request that CF is totally Neutral or Moore Complimentary only?"

No, this is me speaking as me, strictly so. I just believe that some types will do anythign for attention, even if it's megative. Everyone here can post how they like, within forum rules.

No, it's just a personal opinion. I love this place because it's a place for TOS fans to hang out without worrying about being ganged up on. I would personally like to just focus more on the actual original series, and not so much on "look what those so and so's are doing now". News is cool, but I get tired of seeing them pop up in every post.

What do you think?

[LordStarFyre]

...Right now, we're in a Battle for Galactica. Like it or not, the times for simple discussion and neutrality has passed.

For too long, people kept saying "Wait and See, Ron Moore is a Professional, and his other work was so good, let's play nice and maybe he'll give us the Galactica we've hoped for".

Well? What did that get us?

We were told in Moore's Q&A that he was going to Honor the TOS. Did he?

Then we got hold of the Script, and then we were ram-rodded by Moore Zealots.

All I'm saying Micheleh is that once the Offical Word from Universal comes out, whichever way things go, then will be the time to celebrate the TOS, or to Mourn it's passing. Til then, squelching the opinions of the Fans of Galactica, the Real Galactica, not this Mooreised Nonsense being passed off as Galactica, is akin to sitting on our hands, and allowing those that stand against what we're fighting for to roll happily over us, with hardly a whisper.

We TRIED to play nice, and Moore LIED bold face to us. We waited, after the admonishment of those willing to give Moore a chance, and we were greeted by a hard Slap in the Face, and over-run by Moore Fans telling us that they knew better what Galactica needed, because they had read the "Script".

I'm not trying to argue with you Micheleh, this is your board, and if you want neutrality within the postings, that's fine, and I'll abide by those rules. But while we're idlely discussing the TOS, the "other side" is pushing to steam roll over the TOS, and painting over it, entirely.

[Stevew]

Agreed LSF. I have always tried to be civil but will only go so far.
BTW I thought this was Darrell's board?
S:D

[Micheleh]

No, I agree, and I'm glad we can discuss it. This is something that has caused arguments here, and I'd like to understand why- that's why I ask people's opinions.

No, it's not a rule at all, just me being curious. I don't want to make decisions without knowing how people feel about things. It's not my board by any means- Warrior was just nice enough to let me try to help out.

It's good to be able to vent. I just realise that there are some here who still hope that RM will do the right thing, and who may feel it isn't entirely safe for them to say so, with feelings running so high. I appreciate your honesty.

[LordStarFyre]

I've seen this Battle going on for 25 years, and I've never been more convinced that now is NOT the time to sit back and play nice.

Ron Moore WILL NOT DO THE RIGHT THING. He is very clear on his intentions, and those are to re-create Galactica in his own image. He is quoted, by more than one person, as saying that he feels this is his ticket to being "the next Gene Roddenbery or George Lucas".

One only needs to look at the Script he wrote to see the utter contempt he has, not only for the TOS, but for the Fans of the TOS.

Sure, we'll see Vipers from the original, one, revived from a Junk heap. Sure, we'll see Cylons from the Original, as background set dressing. Costumes, we found out, were the first thing Moore ordered completely changed. The sets, well, the Bridge looks like the submarine bridge from Hunt for Red October. We all know the other stuff, Female Starbuck, Adama and Ilya Divorced, Drunkard Tigh, Slut Mrs. Tigh, Glowing Spines, and Handjobs.

Does ANY of that sound like "The right thing" to you?

Does Moore show ANY signs that he is changing ANY of that?

I agree, there is a time and a place for Fans of the TOS to just talk about the TOS, and where we'd like to see the Adventures continue, but if we don't stand up, with a collective NO to Ron Moore, and ANYONE who supports his efforts, everything we knew and loved about the TOS is going to be washed away in favor of "Melrose Place in Space" (That quote comes from David Eick HIMSELF)

Yes, there are those here that want Moore to Win. That's fine, let them come up with some better arguments than "You just want 70's TV and Disco Hair" or "You just want to get Richard Hatch a Job". (I'd bring up the other, much more amusing one I got here, but I'll leave it to your memory)

I dare say, I haven't fought this battle for 25 years to watch it be completely destroyed just so some self agrandised Star Trek groupies can have Galactica reformed into Star Trek with a Battlestar Galactica label slapped on it.

[Micheleh]

I understand your feelings. I just think that this board stands out (and is attacked so often) because the members here- all of them- have a tendency to show a far higher level of maturity than the average. I just don't want us to lose sight of that fact, whatever the provocation.

[LordStarFyre]

...Because of that Level of Maturity that CF is know for that this MUST be where the Fans of the TOS make their stand!

Clone/Troll Central is fine for broadcasting wideband messages against this Abomination, but CF should be the lightning rod for getting the message out, without having to worry about a mass fleet of Clones and Trolls to wade through.

If there are those in favor of Moore here that find that notion offensive, then so be it. There is a Pro-Moore board that they can feel comfortable with.

[Micheleh]

I suppose, I just wish it din't have to be quite so black and white. Us or them, support us opr get out- there has to be some room for grey area.

*chuckle* That's what I get for trying to figure out motivations. I'll take off the personal hat and get back to work. Thank you for being so candid- I appreciate it.

[Stevew]

With some there is no grey area and should be delt with accordingly
S:D

[LordStarFyre]

...As well, but seriously, what other avenue is left.

When we talked Compromise with the Moore Fans, and Moore, we were told "OK, we'll change 5-10% if you'll take 90% of what we want".

Many of us were more than willing to consider going Prequel, as a HUGE Compromise. That way Moore and his followers could have an entire timeline within the Galactica Universe, and still leave the TOS timeline intact.

What was their response? Side Story Concepts, that once again left Moore's Production 95% intact, and the TOS almost completely overwritten.

While many of them were talking Compromise, they were busy, behind the scenes, sending letters, faxs, phone calls screaming for the re-imagining. Even their Leader had his Boss write a letter in favor of re-imagining (a Certain US Senator).

We didn't start this battle, they did. We were fighting to Revive Galactica, the TOS Galactica, the one where Starbuck was a Man, where values and morals existed, and where Heroes didn't have to be classic psychotics to be heroes.

No, Micheleh, we didn't start this battle, but if we don't fight back, we will lose this battle, and we will lose Galactica.

[Micheleh]

All right. I'm asking these things, you understand, to avoid the chance of operating without all the information I can get.

How about this- we agree that everyone can state what their opinions and preferences are here, and discuss them, as long as they respect the rights of others to their own opinions and preferences, don't try to 'prove each other wrong', and carry on whatever debates may arise by concentrating on the facts, not personal slams? This is just an idea of mine, but I'd like to know what people think.

I admit there are definite side to this, I just don't want to lose sight of the fact that there are good people here of differing opinion, and some shouldn't have to feel that because of the current climate, brought about by the malice of non members who get much attention here, that they have to be non-contributing for fear of being lumped in with those malicious troublemakers.

(Note to self- ask again about spel chekker for posts.)

[LordStarFyre]

Micheleh.

As I said, this is your board, and I'll abide by your rules.

:X

[Micheleh]

It's not my board! Good gods, don't give Darrell any ideas, or he'll send me the bills! Lol! I can't even afford an opinion right now....;)

No, post what you want. I'd *personally* just like poeple to be aware that it isn't about sides, it's about members, and when we all meet at the con, I want it to be good for everyone.

[jewels]

Originally posted by LordStarFyre
...As well, but seriously, what other avenue is left.

While many of them were talking Compromise, they were busy, behind the scenes, sending letters, faxs, phone calls screaming for the re-imagining. Even their Leader had his Boss write a letter in favor of re-imagining (a Certain US Senator).

We didn't start this battle, they did. We were fighting to Revive Galactica, the TOS Galactica, the one where Starbuck was a Man, where values and morals existed, and where Heroes didn't have to be classic psychotics to be heroes.

No, Micheleh, we didn't start this battle, but if we don't fight back, we will lose this battle, and we will lose Galactica.

So LSF:
How do we begin again? I've been feeling way too quiet since last Sunday, yet I sense that the battle is close to concluding (though it's gone through more twists, turns and tunnels in the last 2-3 months than I care to count). How do we keep everyone psyched to keep voicing that they are still standing (and waiting). How do we fight back?

jewels

[LordStarFyre]

I wish I could say, but I wouldn't want to make anyone uncomfortable...

[KJ]

When someone attacks Michael or anybody else with an untruth, I am compelled to defend them.

So would i, damn pity i'm the opposite SteveW. When i get attack by untruths i have to do my own fighting, not that i don't mind fighting my own battles. But the self doubt people choose to have about me, is mind blowing?

SteveW has hit the nail on the head again I have always tried to be civil but will only go so far.
This alone sums up the issues i got with the other place and posters over there.

But enough of me, there is alot of banning, childish vendettas, and nonsense afoot and i myself had something to address to you all. Don't worry i'm gonna give it to some of you via PM soon, after that i don't know, only after Saturday i see things differently now.

Cos mine was confirmed by a source with a clear POV on things. As others will soon come forward with themselves.

As a Galactica fan, this will be one of the last things i do to share with fellow fans.

We all have things to do in are lives seperate of this love of Battlestar Galactica. And some of us have recently been enlighten to getting real facts and supportting BG by rallying effort, while tending to matters in your own life and not getting caught up with too much trivial nonsense.

Keep putting the word out there warriors, but turn away from the battles with the doubters, words of wisdom say GET THE REAL FACTS AND DISCUSS WHAT YOU KNOW, TALK TO UNIVERSAL FIND OUT WHATS GOING ON, IGNORE THE SPECULATION, CONTINUE STRONG LINES OF COMMUNICATION WITH OTHERS AND WORK TOWARDS SOMETHING. ( just something i heard recently, but i guess doubters already ask themselves questions or doubt me again, o.k. never mind, not my loss though is it? )

KJ

[Erzengel]

Can I hear what you have to say via PM?

[Dawg]

I'd like to hear.

I am
Dawg
:warrior:

[thomas7g]

I'm saddened by seeing "defending" which ends up into personal attacks against other members.

Though I think it is a very good thing to reassure people who have been attacked, but I don't counterattacking rude members really helps. It makes it much harder for a moderater to isolate and deal with one bad member.

I would really advise that instead of defending we need to wait till the mods can deal with the problem. That would work best. :)

[jewels]

thomas: in one of the situations, the mod was part of the problem.
Jewels

[SS1]

Originally posted by Micheleh
[B I love this place because it's a place for TOS fans to hang out without worrying about being ganged up on. I would personally like to just focus more on the actual original series, and not so much on "look what those so and so's are doing now". News is cool, but I get tired of seeing them pop up in every post.

What do you think? [/B]


Then maybe you should hang out in the Galactica Cafe. They seem to be clueless to what's going on in the revival.

They still engage in discussions about the original series.

I am not slamming them and I do like them.

It is time to face reality Micheleh. The Original Galactica fandom is at war. We were unjustly attacked and now it is time for us to go on the offence.

If you do not want to lift a finger to help your fellow fans then that is your problem, but stop telling the active fans to just sit and do abslotly nothing!

If you can’t play with the big boys than maybe you should moderate a different section from with in this forum.

Thank you!

[Micheleh]

I know what's going on quite well, but my job here is to be a moderator, not a warmonger. If someone can communicate theri view without being insulting or resorting to personal attacks, it doesn't matter what it is. They may run into heavy debate, but as long as it doesn't turn into a personal thing, debate away.

[JediMasterGynac]

no one has a problem with being civil. Please don't ask us to not fight for what we believe in in the same breath though. It's a hard pill to swallow.

[Micheleh]

I'm not asking anyone to not fight for what they believe in. I just think it's possible to do so without calling someone a no-life jerk, get your a** out of our forum, and similar. Or for someone to come in here out of nowhere and tell everyone they are hopeless losers fighting a doomed battle- neither one is cool.

It's about being able to debate without attacking- a problem that comes up at every forum where there's a hot topic.

[JediMasterGynac]

that's how I feel too.

[Micheleh]

Yaay! I'm happy now. I've been knocking myself out lately, and my eloquence isn't so great.. thanks. I agree with you on this one.

[SS1]

Originally posted by Micheleh
I know what's going on quite well, but my job here is to be a moderator, not a warmonger.

Oh so now you are calling us warmongers. Micheleh you have not been around long enough to make that call.

Well you are not flat out calling us warmongers but you are insinuating that people such as myself and Lordstarfyre are.

[Micheleh]

No, I'm saying that I'm *not*. I'm not going to get sucked into anything, either, so chill. ;)

[Hito]

Okee let me break it down like this.
From now in in your "debates"

From now on MooreRons are now "Moore Supports".
Trekkie Scum is now "Trek fandom".
That Moore Jerk will now be simply "Ron Moore"
Axis of evil will now be the G 03 production staff
Bonie "broomstick" hammer is actually amusing so it can stand "as is" :).
Mindless drones are now just republicans. (that was a joke) :D

For those of us not 100% in line with the continuation agenda the language will be more like...
Instead of brutush thug or natzi the term will be simply Continuaiton fandom, or continuaiton activist.
Instead of acusing original series fans of riding the jock of one of the stars we will simply refer to that person as an admirer or simply "fan".

You get the picture...
In other words procede as usual.
Minus the insults.

[thomas7g]

WHOA SCOOTER!

I think we are saying things in a way that's kinda rough on our beloved Micheleh.

I also disagree with giving people a hard time just because they are not as fighting as hard as you believe they should be against the new Moore vision.

I don't want to see this forum become a place of war and infighting.

[thomas7g]

And Micheleh may not have been as long as me or Darrell and others who have been here from 3dg's inception... but Micheleh has the rank and the approval of the people who run and maintain this place.

*hugs Micheleh*

:D

[Micheleh]

Aww... thanks, Thomas! *warm fuzzies*

I'm sure scooter is just reacting in his own way and how he thinks best for everyone- I don't take it personally. We just have different views, that's all.

[Hito]

And you like Gundam so that makes u double cool

[Micheleh]

Duo is my personal favorite. Go figure... ;)

[BST]

I have been reading this thread with much interest. Now, I ask each person reading this thread, if you have read ALL of the replies.

My point is that through the course of the thread, we diverged from the real reason that we are frequent this place:

The Return of BATTLESTAR GALACTICA, in a form that does not trample the theme, concepts, history, storyline, and characters of the ORIGINAL SERIES!!

THAT is our PRIORITY!

PERIOD!

We are in agreement about much of this, however, we spend too much time debating the miniscule details. We spend too much time defending our positions. We are too preoccupied with what the trolls on the other forums are saying and doing. Sure, it bothers us, we're human after all. But, the point is that those very things are sapping the energy from us that could be channelled in a direction that would better enable us to achieve our goal.

Case in point, there are members here that have had to defend themselves, because of a clone handle on another forum. If we truly know these persons, by the character of their posts here and by their history in the various BSG forums then, we should be able to see when something out of character like that happens. We should be able to see that it is a clone handle! Those persons should NOT need to defend themselves to me or to anyone else!

Another case, and this is minor, I had to respond to a flippant remark by a rather new 'member' (une) regarding my feelings about TOS (re: "It's my turn to rant"). The tactics used by une were of the nickel and dime variety, but apparently effective enough to get me to reply. That's my point, I had to waste time replying to someone who (now), in my opinion, was not worthy of a reply. We've all had to do this at one time or another. Do you agree that it draws time and energy away from the Primary Goal??

Maybe that is part of the war plan of the 'other side'. "Do what damage you can to your opponent's idea so that your own idea can look 'better'."

Having said all of the above, I want you folks to know how much I truly enjoy your company. We are all 'brothers & sisters in arms". We are all involved in the same battle. Because of that, I want to say that I truly am sorry if I stepped on anyone's toes or walked through anyone's flowerbed. It was not my intent to be personally offensive. I just wanted to help, in whatever small way, get the ship back on course.

After reading this, some may tell me where to go and/or what to do with it. That is your prerogative.

I will continue to do all that I can to support the Primary Goal -- the Return of the BATTLESTAR GALACTICA that I know and love!

KTFF,

BST

[Micheleh]

No, I agree with youu completely. i want everyone to be able to express theri feelings, and all be welcome, since we are all BG fans, just with a few different ideas.

If you have trouble with anyone- or if anyone does- please PM a mod first before being provoked, so we can all try to work things out without a battle. I think that would be a good idea.

[SS1]

Originally posted by BST
I have been reading this thread with much interest. Now, I ask each person reading this thread, if you have read ALL of the replies.

My point is that through the course of the thread, we diverged from the real reason that we are frequent this place:

The Return of BATTLESTAR GALACTICA, in a form that does not trample the theme, concepts, history, storyline, and characters of the ORIGINAL SERIES!!

THAT is our PRIORITY!

PERIOD!


Ditto!

Converting Moore’s script into a prequel was not asking for too much but the Neos felt that we were conspiring to bring Tom DeSanto back at a later date so he can put Ronald D Moore in his place with a continuation project.

That was never the case. All we wanted was the original series timeline to be intact along side Moore’s vision.

The Neos want Ron to be in complete control as the Guardian of the Galactica universe. That will never be the case as long as Ron’s production is called Battlestar Galactica. Universal owns BSG and it is theirs to control not Ron’s.

My Choices are in order of preferences:

1. Tom Desanto's production.

2. A distant sequel after the time of the original characters passed on.

3. Richard Hatch's vision sans the full blooded Kobolian felbercarb.

4. Ron Moore's current script converted into a prequel with some rewrites and improvements and an open letter of apology to the fans.

As for the current production, I will never watch it nor give it the time of day.

As for Hito's recent rants about the fan's being at fault about DeSanto's removal, I urge him to please check the Sci-Fi archives since 2-22-01. You will find that I was an out spoken supporter of DeSanto and Singer since day one.

When my friend KF2 landed a gig for the upcoming X2 movie under the supervision of Michael Fink, I got first hand knowledge of DeSanto's production and I was relieved to know that BSG was in safe hands with Tom DeSanto.

[thomas7g]

well... incase anyone ever doubts who wears the pants in this forum I upgraded Micheleh's title ;)

[Micheleh]

Actually, I was kind of hoping it would be "God of Death", lol! :D

(even better)

[Micheleh]

Trekkie, Trekker....
potato, potahto... ;)

[Hito]

Trrkkie's wear their uniforms in public.
Trekkers wear their uniforms in secret...