How much of Colonial Warriors is hereditary?

[jewels]

I noticed something in GOIPZ today.

Leda is encouraging Croft to ditch the Arcta mission and go for his own freedom with the other convict team members. She critizes him for not firing on a colonial warrior in their previous escapade and that causing them to be caged up like animals.

her line is something to the effect of him not violating "the oath, the bloodline."

Bloodline? would this mean that most warriors had a family tradition of service to the colonies or would it imply an almost tribal or class relationship between the warriors (I'm thinking along the lines of the Spartans? perhaps, but I'm not that versed in the actual ancient cultures to know).

Any history buffs want to take a stab at what Leda meant by "bloodline" as a reason to not shoot a fellow warrior?

Jewels

[repcisg]

It is common in history to find fimilies with a history of military service, most kindoms have been founded on this principle. In our own time General Patton came from a "Military" family, one of his grandsons is I beleive currently an officer in the Army. Senitor McCain is the son of the famous Admiral McCain of WWII.

I think it would be resonable to have "Warrior" families (like Adama's). It would be a betrayal of the blood to shoot a fellow warrior in cold blood.

[jewels]

Thanks, Rep. I was just wondering, with all the ancient civilization clues imbedded in Galactica, if this wasn't a little allusion to some of the structures of ancient greek city-states, Sparta especially came to mind.

Jewels

[Archangel]

Or possibly reminiscent of the knights of olde. Where all the knights were of 'noble' birth.

Just a thought

*

[Darrell Lawrence]

Other than Adama's family, the only other "family" we met was Starbuck's father Chameleon. And he was not a Warrior.

[Archangel]

Was he some kind of con man? (No, I'm not confusing Starbuck with Dirk's other character. )

[jewels]

Originally Posted by Warrior

Other than Adama's family, the only other "family" we met was Starbuck's father Chameleon. And he was not a Warrior.

Sheba and Cain too, Warrior.

[jewels]

Originally Posted by Archangel

Was he some kind of con man? (No, I'm not confusing Starbuck with Dirk's other character. )

Chameleon? yes, con man and card player/gambler. Ladies man too. Interesting genes our Starbuck has.

Jewels

Starbuck was an orphan. He never mentioned being adopted. His finding his father was more coincidence than anything else. If an orphan can be a warrior it would appear anyone could if they wanted to go through and successfully completed the required training. In a 1,000 yahren war I doubt they could have limited the warrior corps to nobility for too long.

One note on warriors: All "warriors" are not officers. Many of the pilots had ranks that would be enlisted in our military. Jolly comes immediately to mind. It would appear that one becomes a pilot without becoming an officer. Whether officers are selected through the ranks or are products of a separate program is never explained. From what I understand and you Brits and Aussies can correct me, the colonial military in terms of pilot ranks more reflects the RAF and RAAF then it does the USAF or U.S. Navy.

Originally Posted by repcisg

It is common in history to find fimilies with a history of military service, most kindoms have been founded on this principle. In our own time General Patton came from a "Military" family, one of his grandsons is I beleive currently an officer in the Army. Senitor McCain is the son of the famous Admiral McCain of WWII.

I think it would be resonable to have "Warrior" families (like Adama's). It would be a betrayal of the blood to shoot a fellow warrior in cold blood.

I agree its probably a personal thing and not necesarily a societal thing. In America we have no military officer caste but we definitely have a segment of the population that has its own military tradition that seems to continue for generations especially among elements in Southern society (50% of the U.S. Army officer corps).

My own family on my fathers side has seen ever male serve in the military since they immigrated to America almost 100 years ago. Members of that group have fought in 4 wars already. Someone in the family has served on active duty since at least 1965.

My little brother now in high school does not plan to serve in the military. Although no one puts any pressure on him about the subject you can tell from time to time from things he says that somehow he thinks he is letting down the family and tradition.

[Darrell Lawrence]

Originally Posted by jewels

Sheba and Cain too, Warrior.

Oh yeah... them too

[gmd3d]

I still like the idea that adamas family were members of the colonial Elite,
I fancy the idea, that the elite familes are responsible for the protection of the
peoples of the planet or tribe they are from.

perhaps not only as military guardians but as leaders in their Society. like Cassi tells Starbuck she is designated as a socilator?.. could there be a social order the can be very rigged and for the colonies to work.

roughly specking something like in babylon5. the minbari. are one part warrior, one part Religious, the other part builder.

in the first book, i think adama recives command of the galactica from his father.
perhaps Adama family were the ones that built her, or funded the galactica in
part. there is no evidence but it would be intresting.

[justjackrandom]

Originally Posted by Archangel

Or possibly reminiscent of the knights of olde. Where all the knights were of 'noble' birth.

You may be on to something here, although the idea of knights being of ‘noble’ blood is incorrect. Quite the opposite, most knights were not of noble birth, but were instead common. Only knights invested into knightly orders had to be of noble birth...and even that's questionable when you consider that events often caused there to be a difference between 'noble' as in noble blood, and 'noble' as in peerage (this caused a great deal of strife in late medieval England).

I suggest that much like becoming a knight, when a Colonial becomes a Warrior, they don’t just sign some papers, take the oath and become soldiers. Instead they are ‘invested’ into the brotherhood of Warriors. The investment ceremony and oath have stronger significance to some Colonials than to others. During the ceremony, a ‘transubstantiation’ event is thought to occur, by which all Warriors indeed become of one bloodline; i.e. they are partially transformed to literally become brothers. Some probably see this as literal (much like most Catholics believe in the transubstantiation of the Host during communion), others as symbolic. Those who view the investment as symbolic will probably take it with greater or lesser seriousness depending on how religious they are.

my tuppence

JJR

[jewels]

Now that's an interesting take, JJR. With some of the implied mysticism in Colonial society, it might not be far off the mark in some senses.

[Darrell Lawrence]

JJR, that premise would make a fantastic Colonial Academy story...

[Fragmentary]

I've got to chime in the with others, JJR.
That's a very interesting conjecture. It really does fit with a lot of the mysticism from TOS and helps to explain some of the odd phrases used to describe colonial warriors.

[gmd3d]

I suggest that much like becoming a knight, when a Colonial becomes a Warrior, they don’t just sign some papers, take the oath and become soldiers. Instead they are ‘invested’ into the brotherhood of Warriors. The investment ceremony and oath have stronger significance to some Colonials than to others. During the ceremony, a ‘transubstantiation’ event is thought to occur, by which all Warriors indeed become of one bloodline

Yes, I like that take too.
in the Saga Of A Starworld, Apollo told a women that they will get food to them.
and when he said 'I give you my word as a warrior' she laughs in his face.

That was always a important part, warriors were looked on as old knights
worthy of respect. they become warrior through a rite of passage, oaths given
to the seals of the lords of kobol..or something?

Since they appear to have both enlisted and officer ranks which all are considered "warriors" I doubt any nobility applies. I suggest that being a "warrior" may be a thing of pride and honor in the society that does not come from ones upbringing. The closest I could see in our society is the brotherhood and honor confired on those who are "marines" or "paratroopers". Saying one is a "marine" or "paratrooper" regardless of rank is viewed by most in society as synonymous with honor and courage. I bet "warrior", especially in time of war holds similar feelings among colonial society before Saga of A Star World.

[repcisg]

Once a marine always a marine.
Once a paratrooper always a paratrooper.

Members of these services take that membership with great pride, for they know not everyone can do what they have done. I see Warriors as seeing themselves in this mode.

[Fragmentary]

I think its got be something more than that. I mean, yeah there's a lot of honor in the Marines, airborne and special forces, but that doesn't really extend outside of the ranks. I mean if someone were to say to the average citizen, "you have my word on it as a Marine" WTF? That doesn't carry any extra weight. The show uses Warrior as a title that means something extra to everyone, military and civilian. That means its significance has to carry beyond the battlefield and into everyday life. That suggests that being a warrior carries an expection that the person has a certain nobility beyond their job. Say, the trust that people have for their priest or minister vs the police. One is a noble profession, the other is a noble lifestyle. (supposedly)