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Old March 16th, 2005, 09:58 PM   #1
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Star Trek Interesting Insights into the "Kirk" ENT episodes

From Star Trek.com:

Grand Slam XIII – Sunday Recap - Writers/Producers Panel

Manny Coto, Mike Sussman, Andre Bormanis, Judith & Garfield Reeves-Stevens

The panel of writers who created the bulk of the fourth season of Enterprise were given a special introduction by Eugene Roddenberry Jr., who credited them with bringing "integrity and passion" to the show. And the audience agreed with their deafening applause.

Manny Coto began by thanking the fans for all of their support. "We've had a blast. And, y'know, there've been some rumors about, oh, a cancellation thing, but we're treating them as just that, rumors!" The audience erupted in laughter and applause. "It seems that some of the sets have been taken down, but we're just assuming they've been taken out to be washed!"

The convention-goers were treated to a sneak preview of the upcoming mirror-universe two-parter, "In a Mirror, Darkly," which airs April 22 and 29. Before they showed clips, though, the writers explained the long history of the concept. "We had talked about doing a mirror universe episode ever since we got into Season Four," Coto began. "But then we had the possibility of getting William Shatner. Coincidentally, the Reeves-Stevens [who have worked with Shatner on several Trek novels] were a pair of writers whom I desperately wanted to bring on the show. And they, it turned out, had an idea for a mirror universe two-parter which would feature the return of William Shatner."

At past conventions, Shatner has spoken about a story concept which he himself pitched that was well received. But Paramount and Shatner failed to reach agreement so, as we know, Shatner wouldn't be making a guest appearance on Enterprise. However, the Reeves-Stevens couple (affectionately called "the Bynars" by their fellow writers) were now able to reveal what that pitch was.

"The idea was that the Tantalus Field was not a disintegrator, it was a humane way of dealing with prisoners, by sending them back in time to a sealed penal colony," Garfield Reeves-Stevens explained. "Enterprise NX-01 comes upon the colony — and Tiberius [mirror-Kirk] is there. Tiberius thinks, 'Finally, a ship with a transporter — I can get back to my own universe, my own time.' He basically goes on the NX-01, gets to the transporter, sets it to go back to the mirror universe — the mirror universe doesn't exist." "It hasn't been created yet," Judith elaborated. Garfield continued: "So Tiberius and Archer work together to figure out where the division point is between the universes, what point that one split off into the other. And as it turns out, Tiberius and Archer together are responsible for the creation of the mirror universe."

Coto recounted that Shatner pitched the idea to him, Brannon Braga and Rick Berman over lunch. They loved it, but Berman pitched an alternative concept, which was actually devised by Mike Sussman.

So Sussman explained that: "Shatner was going to be 'Chef' — an ancestor of Kirk. We would find out that at some point in the future the real Kirk got into trouble, got taken out of history. And Daniels would show up, he would grab Archer, he would grab Chef — who of course looked like William Shatner — and say, 'You have to go to the future and impersonate Captain Kirk in some important ceremony.' That was the setup."

"We pitched this to Shatner and there was a long silence," Coto continued. Well, since negotiations fell through, there would be no Kirk story, but they still wanted to do a mirror-universe two-parter. "We started bandying about ideas, trying to figure out a way to get our characters into the mirror universe, because as you all know in the Original Series the mirror universe was pretty much a first-contact situation. What do we do about that? We came up with a concept of doing the story solely in the mirror universe. As if you're watching a Star Trek: Enterprise episode coming straight from the mirror universe, including a whole new title sequence. And there's very little interaction with our regular universe.

They settled on a concept that Sussman had been entertaining for awhile. "For me, it was an irresistible idea that the U.S.S. Defiant from 'The Tholian Web' was still floating out there somewhere in interphase, and we never knew what happened to it," Sussman said. "To me that was a tantalizing story idea I wanted to explore."

They showed two clips from the episode to the convention audience. The first was the "teaser" of Part I. As Sussman explained it, the scene depicted "a pivotal moment from our universe and the mirror universe. And things unfolded a little differently in the mirror universe." Without spoiling it here, suffice it say the convention-goers LOVED it — they were rolling on the floor.
The second clip showed Vaughn Armstrong as the mirror Captain Forrest, the sequence when Forrest orders Archer and his team to board the mysterious vessel from the future. The audience soundly applauded when the Constitution-class Defiant bridge was revealed.

Coto spoke about the experience of working with the Defiant set. "Seeing that bridge was just the greatest thing. We had a steady procession coming onto those soundstages for the week or so that bridge was up — people from all over calling up and wanting to get shots and photos in the captain's chair. It was a great example of how popular the Original Series still is. I hope you enjoy the episode. We had a blast writing it."

During Q & A, Coto revealed how he was able to talk Peter Weller into guest-starring in the penultimate two-parter, "Demons" and "Terra Prime." "Peter wants to direct, so I said to him, 'I want you to come on the show, and I can't spend a lot of money.' And he's like, 'Great, can you offer me some directing gigs?' I said, 'All right — Season Five, you can direct two episodes! And he's like, 'Great, all right!' So he signs the deal, and the day after he signs the deal, we get the cancellation. He calls me up, 'Ya hornswoggled me!'"

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Old March 16th, 2005, 10:13 PM   #2
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Hmmm.... Berman screwed that one up. I liked Shatners idea alot more. You would think for ratings they would do whatever they could to get Shatner on the show, all it would have taken was to stroke his ego a little, and his idea was really good. But Berman had to have his way... Oh well and the rest is history!
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Old March 16th, 2005, 10:16 PM   #3
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Yuck!

Kirk is dead. Let's keep Shatner, and the Beebs, as far away from Trek as possible.
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Old March 22nd, 2005, 05:22 AM   #4
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Kirk is awsome! Anyway, I agree, Berman is such a hack. The blame can be spread but played an essential part in Star Trek getting ruined. Thanks, Ricky.
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Old March 22nd, 2005, 06:40 AM   #5
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"Jim Kirk's body lies a moldin' in the grave."
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Old April 25th, 2005, 06:02 PM   #6
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They borrowed the helm viewer (the piece that came out of the helm console that Sulu always looked thru) for the 2 part Mirror eps from the people at newvoyages.com (used to be 5yearmission.com) That piece normally resides about 50 yards from my house. As of 4/22, it hadn't been returned yet.

After I get moved this summer, I think I'm gonna get involved with that production. Building sets or something, cuz my mug's too ugly to be seen nation (or world) wide.
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Old April 25th, 2005, 09:29 PM   #7
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Default I hate to sound like a hater

But boy does Berman suck.

I've read Shatners star trek novels and they're pretty decent as such fare goes. More importantly he has a feel for the history and the chronology and the background of star trek, something Berman doesn't have. The only problem I have with the novels is their tendency to make Picard seem decidely lackluster compared to Kirk (In one gaffe that remains with me to this day the heroes realize that the Enterprise needs to be in two places at one time. *Kirk* comes up with seperating the saucer section, something he shouldn't even know about, when Picard should've come up with this).

It's obvious from the pitches that fans would've at least enjoyed the shatner pitched one. But Berman's chef idea? So lame no-one likes it and Shatner knows that he doesn't need to crap all over the character of Kirk. Which is why the stony response. The novels 'fix' the atrocious death of Kirk in Generations and Shatner knows what Kirks character should be used for.
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Old April 28th, 2005, 01:36 AM   #8
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Angry Way to Go Berman!

Don't forget the other half of the Killer Bees who killed the FRANCHISE.

Bragga!




Berman left, Jeri Ryan center, Bragga right,

Just so that you will know the Killer Bees by sight, folks.

I really don't like their(Berman and Bragga) work product.
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Old April 28th, 2005, 05:08 PM   #9
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I have to agree. I do think that their intentions were good, but they just couldn't deliver a quality ST product.
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Old April 28th, 2005, 11:16 PM   #10
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Personally, I'm glad they kept Kirk out of it. I think it would have just cheapened the show (I know its really hard to do that anymore, but hey). All it would show is once again that this show isnt good enough to stand on its own two feet, so they brought in someone from another series to lift its profile. The Kirk episode with the finale with Riker and Troi just would have been an overload of past series stars, when there shouldnt be any past stars anyway. From what I've heard elsewhere, the end product was pretty well done, and most seem happy with it as is.

One interesting thing is the point of divergance, as apparently in the Mirror credits a different moon landing is shown. This shows us that divergance must have happened pre-1969.

And yes B&B suck, and I doubt few would disagree.
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Old April 29th, 2005, 01:04 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanky

And yes B&B suck, and I doubt few would disagree.
You can blame Berman for the decline of Trek ( I won't stop you ) but to be fair, you also have to credit him for the enormous success as well. It was after all Rick Berman who guided Trek to become the entertainment monster that it has become. And that includes the highs as well as the lows.
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Old April 29th, 2005, 03:53 AM   #12
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Oh I dont disagree that he has done great things for Trek, but they are a distant memory. If B&B suddenly went back to they're old selfs of TNG and DS9 era, I would be jumping for joy. But alas, power corrupts, and absolute power is kinda fun
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They went insane.
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They look and sound rational.
Some are programmed to think they are right.
There are many versions.
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Old April 29th, 2005, 05:38 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanky
Oh I dont disagree that he has done great things for Trek, but they are a distant memory. If B&B suddenly went back to they're old selfs of TNG and DS9 era, I would be jumping for joy. But alas, power corrupts, and absolute power is kinda fun
Tanky, I just noticed your sig, that's frakkin' funny. What are you doing in Australia with a sig like that? We haven't exported the Neocons down there have we?
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Old April 29th, 2005, 09:08 PM   #14
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Fortunately no. My dad actually lives in Washington DC so I always hearing about the latest crazy neo-con plans. I'm also a politics student so I try and keep up to date with the worlds political happenings.

Your actually the first person to comment on my sig. Another guy at this trek forum I go to actually made it, but I loved it and thought it'd be great to have around here.
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The Neocons were created by Americans.
They went insane.
They devolved.
They look and sound rational.
Some are programmed to think they are right.
There are many versions.
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"Lord, please save me from your followers"
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