Galactica is Cursed

[Dean Martin]

http://www.blast.net/hart/curse.htm

From Sheba herself:

Bottom line, I'm not sure there is any new Galactica that could satisfy the fans. What I truly want (and I think most fans feel the same) is what can never be. What I truly want is for the original series to have never been canceled.

[Belloby]

The only thing that will satisify original series fans is an update with the original characters. How can you possibly recreate a series that relied almost entirely on the feelings of the cast for its success?

[Dean Martin]

I don't think you can convince a studio to bring this back in continued form.
First of all, it was not successful financial originally.
The cast is much older combined with the span between the orignal and now. I realize the Trek actors were of similar age but the reruns of trek created a much larger fan base than the BSG fan base has, or at least what I read.

And that reminds me, look at Trek. A movie was made that was a continuation and the fans were pissed. I thought it was great. The V'Ger concept was a good one.
Then the fans called Star Trek 2 "The apology".
Shows you how some fans are never happy.

You have to show studios that not only is there interest but you can make money and do it for cheap.
Ron Moore was able to write something that could avoid some of the expenses but what he missed was that characters could be explored without them all hating each other.

Godd drama doesn't have to be about someone calling another person a drunken bastard or Apollo blaming Adama for the death of his brother.
The drama was in the struggle for survival and where that put each of them.
If I witnessed my whole civilization die out, the last thing I would be thinking about is what an ass col tigh is.

[GreggAllinson]

As awesome as the Second Coming trailer was (I saw it at Dragoncon '99) and as much as I admire Richard Hatch's revival efforts, I don't believe a continuation is the *only* way to go. In fact, realistically speaking, it's a long shot.

My problem is, they strayed waaaaaaay too far from the original with the mini. Honestly, I'd've had less of a problem with there being no Starbuck and Boomer and having the two ladies in question playing, say, Sheba and Athena than I had with Starbuck and Boomer going through sex changes. And IMO, there's absolutely no excuse for the virtual exclusion of black actors from the new production (not to mention the virtual exclusion of all mythical elements from Galactica!).

[jewels]

Originally posted by Dean Martin
I don't think you can convince a studio to bring this back in continued form.
First of all, it was not successful financial originally.

Incorrect on that account. It was cancelled due to it being too difficult to manage as a weekly series (12-14 production days vs. the normal 7) that is from Glen's speech at Galacticon. Universal made major bucks on it, ABC wasn't in on the merchandising however and those were the sweet $$.

The cast is much older combined with the span between the orignal and now. I realize the Trek actors were of similar age but the reruns of trek created a much larger fan base than the BSG fan base has, or at least what I read.

the problem with BSG's popularity is it broke the genre mold: people that aren't generally scifi fans watched and loved it. And are keeping the videogame and the dvd sales skyrocketing. It makes it hard to judge actual fanbase size as it's been in syndication or on video worldwide for 25 yrs. (there's a fanclub in Turkey of all places!)

You have to show studios that not only is there interest but you can make money and do it for cheap.

Done. DVD, videogame sales, Richard's novels, Reissued soundtrack....oh and those mini ratings. I love it when a plan comes together!!!! Oh and Richard had 60-80 million to do a feature before Glen went to court in 2000 and sued for the feature rights the 1st time from Uni.

Ron Moore was able to write something that could avoid some of the expenses but what he missed was that characters could be explored without them all hating each other.

He missed the nobility and the hope of the original show. and that is the crux of the matter. We thank him for proving the name recognition though.

Godd drama doesn't have to be about someone calling another person a drunken bastard or Apollo blaming Adama for the death of his brother.
The drama was in the struggle for survival and where that put each of them.
If I witnessed my whole civilization die out, the last thing I would be thinking about is what an ass col tigh is. [/B]

HERE, HERE VERY WELL SAID.

[Dean Martin]

I don't think they strayed that far except in the characters and some minor plot details.

Cylons hate humans, Cylons destroy humans, Humans RUn to survive.
There are Vipers, there's the Galactica, there's the same character names, they are still talking about Earth.

I think that it is different in execution.

[Dean Martin]

Incorrect on that account. It was cancelled due to it being too difficult to manage as a weekly series (12-14 production days vs. the normal 7) that is from Glen's speech at Galacticon. Universal made major bucks on it

Hmmm, well I have read some information that made it appear as though it was finacially motivated.
I would think if something was making that much money it would be continued.

[GreggAllinson]

Originally posted by Dean Martin
I don't think they strayed that far except in the characters

Which is an *awfully* big thing to stray on. I mean, c'mon...that's like saying "Yeah, the lead character might be a black woman from North Carolina who drives a bus for a living...but otherwise, it's still James Bond!"

[repcisg]

I can just see it now, Bonnie sitting at her desk trying to decide what to do with Battlestar Galactica.

Hummmm....

Lets see now,

Man creates the Cylons.

Cylons destroy Man.

Woman inherits the Universe?

[Dean Martin]

I should have said, a couple of characters. Otherwise it's basically the same thing. It's the execution that's different.

[dvo47p]

Originally posted by repcisg
I can just see it now, Bonnie sitting at her desk trying to decide what to do with Battlestar Galactica.

Hummmm....

Lets see now,

Man creates the Cylons.

Cylons destroy Man.

Woman inherits the Universe?

Just not that ‘Been there, done that’ woman!

The Scifi Channel President Bonnie Hammer has some BATTLESTAR GALACTICA quotes:

“Maybe it’ll be a series, maybe NOT”

http://www.cinescape.com/0/Editorial...e&obj_id=35364

“Well, BATTLESTAR is interesting because it worked well as its original series, It didn’t work as well as its second recreation. So what we want to do is a four-hour mini. Basically, give it a new life – maintain the franchise but modernize it and if it works in a mini, then we’ll develop it into a series. If in fact the audience says, ‘Been there, done that’ then we won’t go there.” Bonnie Hammer

I think that there is some truth in the statement that fans are still upset because the original show was cancelled in the first place. I certainly am. That is why it hurts so much to see what Moore has done with the opportunity to bring it back. The mini might call itself Battlestar Galactica, but it has nothing to do with the original show. It is a whole new animal. It seems that fans of Battlestar Galactica are destined to always have a broken heart. First when it was cancelled and again when it was reimagined. Other shows and movies (Star Trek and Star Wars as examples) were brought back and they were faithful to the core themes of their source material. Why is it that Battlestar Galactica did not rate the same consideration? The mini is now history and for good or ill, we will always have to refer to it in future discussions of the production history of the show. I hope this does not fragment the fan base into opposing camps.

[BST]

Originally posted by Dean Martin
I don't think they strayed that far except in the characters and some minor plot details.

I think that it is different in execution.

The premise was changed. TOS had the humans fleeing an enemy which was of "alien" creation, not their own handiwork.

The theme of the show was changed. TOS was a representation of the never-ending fight between good and evil, the mini was not. Moore publically stated that he wanted to portray this as not being the case, that "everything is gray". Moore was so influenced by 9-11 and this script reaked of the "Blame America" mantra that "we are the failed creation" -- that somehow WE are ultimately responsible for the terrorist attacks by Al Qaeda. He portrayed the Cylons as having found "God" and used that as a basis for their attack on the Colonies which could be considered their "jihad".


The character naming conventions with the call-signs were a HUGE change. The new names were too Earth-like, the character names were, for all intents and purposes, nicknames. Who were these people, "distant" brothers and sisters of us or were they us?

Gender change. Nuff said. What purpose did this serve other than do just change the gender? I don't buy Moore's argument for a minute. It insults the intelligence. There were plenty of choices from the original female character base to create a "strong female fighting presence", or a strong female character. Moore did this for name recognition, that's the only reason.

So, Dean, if this was not a radical change from TOS then, what is?

BST

[Dean Martin]

The premise was changed. TOS had the humans fleeing an enemy which was of "alien" creation, not their own handiwork.

The premise of the Cylon origin was changed not the prmise of the show.

TOS was a representation of the never-ending fight between good and evil, the mini was not.

Why aren't the cylons evil in the mini? They certinly are not good guys.

that somehow WE are ultimately responsible for the terrorist attacks by Al Qaeda. He portrayed the Cylons as having found "God" and used that as a basis for their attack on the Colonies which could be considered their "jihad".

Using history as a guide, do we not share ANY responsibilities for the way the middle East has developed? The major powers of the world have used and abused the middle East hrough manipulation and conquest over the centuries. Don't get me wrong, Terroism is not right but we as a race have caused our own problems on Earth.

In TOS it was Man's fault for dropping their guard and allowing the Cylons to trick the colonies in a sneak attack. This was repeated in the mini.
I agree that details were changed but there were still many connections to the old show and the basic layout is still there.
I strongly agree that the gender change was wrong.

[GreggAllinson]

Just because a song uses a few of the same notes don't mean it's a cover.

[BST]

TOS was a representation of the never-ending fight between good and evil, the mini was not.

My point was that Ron Moore stated specifically that this WAS a change from TOS. He was going the "everything is 'gray', no such thing as 'good' and 'evil'" route with his story. (For reference, the interview that TwoBrainedCylon conducted with Ron Moore is available at www.cylon.org )

TOS portrayed Cylons as Evil and the Colonials as Good - an elaboration of this idea was made in War of The Gods with Iblis alluding to the fact that his voice / consciousness was "downloaded" into the IL at the beginning of the 1000 yahren war AND the beings / angels from the Ship of Lights indicated that "as you are now, we once were; as we are now, you may become" indicating that their roots were human and also the possible next step in human evolution.

that somehow WE are ultimately responsible for the terrorist attacks by Al Qaeda. He portrayed the Cylons as having found "God" and used that as a basis for their attack on the Colonies which could be considered their "jihad".

I understand what you're saying -- my point was that there are certain groups in this country that subscribe to the "Blame America" mantra that we "created our own problem" and thus, indirectly "caused the attacks to be carried out against us". The similarity between this line of thinking and what was portrayed on the show is a bit uncanny.

In TOS it was Man's fault for dropping their guard and allowing the Cylons to trick the colonies in a sneak attack. This was repeated in the mini.

Agreed.

I strongly agree that the gender change was wrong.

[Darth Marley]

Jewel, not to be flip, but it seems I read a few of your posts saying you did not watch the mini. Did you change your mind?

Dean martin, I agree with most of what you are saying.

BST, I dig where you are coming from on the "shades of gray" thing. But I live more in the gray. Even among those suspected of being saints,there is among humans a bit of corruption. Even those that behave in an evil and selfish manner can show mercy. I don't have a problem with the mini reflecting this. I have psoted elsewhere a bit of why I think this is still a redeeming message.

[jeditemple]

I just think if they had done the proper research, they could have found a way to please the majority of fans. It's called "compromise." Moore was absolutely THE MAN to blame here. He watched the pilot of TOS and that was it. He had very little understanding of what "Battlestar Galactica" was about and what kept it alive all of these years. He didn't compromise one dang bit.

He didn't meet with the fans and get to know them (like Richard Hatch did). If he had immersed himself just a tiny bit into the culture of BSG, he would have understood, as we do. It's a special show and we have fond memories of it. Instead he set out to piss us off. From his attitude, arrogance, and posturing on the "Lowdown" show, you can tell that he truly despises the fans of TOS. He hated us first.

And that's why I quit watching "Carnivale" as well.

[Dean Martin]

He seems like an arrogant man. That was obvious to me from watching the Lowdown.
Since I have seen him in clips he looks like a deer in the headlights. I don't think he realized how much fan anger would come his way. Why would any person want to step on the fan's show and constantly get flack.
This guy is going to be complained about until a satisfactory conclusion comes for the TOS fans.
His Sci-fi writing days may be over.

[jeditemple]

Originally posted by Dean Martin
He seems like an arrogant man. That was obvious to me from watching the Lowdown......His Sci-fi writing days may be over.

Gosh, I hope so. He has such disdain for TOS fans. I honestly think he poisoned Katee, Tricia, and Jamie towards the fans, because you can see his little pep talks to the cast on the Sci-Fi website. I'm referring to the clips where he refers to us as a small, concentrated group within the larger community of viewers (basically saying we were insignificant, ill informed, and de-humanized by the chats/message boards).

[Dean Martin]

I noticed that. Honestly the only thing I am mad about is the Starbuck sex change. It's a lack of respect for the original fans.